Their love for crossdressing is sincere.

Reader Swanny River commented on the zeal conservative Christians have for the husbands winning their wives without a word:

Take it from a submitted husband, the church has no limits and continue burdening husbands, even once they go to bed exhausted from servant-leadership.
So even if a man succeeds at doing wordless actions to win his wife, the church will not say, “atta boy.” That tells me their real motivations are probably different than they say. In other words, Force and Kendricks are crying crocodile tears for the state of believing households. The leaders are best at Status Quo, and they work to maintain their position, using whatever topic at hand. I made the mistake of thinking they think before talking or writing.

I agree that no amount of husbandly sacrifice or service would ever be enough to satisfy conservative Christians.  No matter how much they get, they are always greedy for more.  But I disagree that this is merely a tactic conservative Christian leaders use to maintain power.  They truly love the new model they have come up with (to replace the Biblical model).  There is a barely hidden giddiness that comes out when modern Christians speak of men submitting to their wives, and especially men suffering because of their rebellious wives, that isn’t in the biblical model.  The Apostle Peter isn’t giddy when he tells wives to win sinning husbands over through submission.  He doesn’t relish the idea of Sarah nearly being raped due to her obedience to sinful Abraham.  The tone regarding this suffering is serious, not triumphant.  Real wives will suffer due to the sins of their husbands, and Peter doesn’t relish this.  Compare the tone of 1 Pet 3:1-6 with Force’s cutesy delight at the idea of husbands suffering while waiting for their submission to win their wives over:

It must be noted that just as Christ loves and then allows us to respond, a man must enter that vacuum of sorts where he does not know how his wife is going to respond. He may be waiting a while, but if I remember, Christ patiently waited for us.

We see the same frame of mind when conservative Christians relish the sin of wives.   Rebellious wives are cherished because only then can the husband truly be made to suffer in his submission.  This is the hair shirt part of the hair shirt and chest thumping theology.  Repentance on the part of the wife would ruin the whole arrangement.

The biblical model has the utmost love for husbands and wives.  The crossdressing model is perverted and features an insatiable craving for rebellion and suffering.

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This entry was posted in Attacking headship, Complementarian, Crossdressing Theology, Disrespecting Respectability, Dr. Raymond Force, Rebellion. Bookmark the permalink.

26 Responses to Their love for crossdressing is sincere.

  1. Pingback: Their love for crossdressing is sincere. | @the_arv

  2. Cane Caldo says:

    Who is a man that he should dare to think Mother should repent?

  3. American says:

    As I left the bank today, a well dressed thirty something feminist with her snoot in the air stepped in front of me and signaled for me to move out of her way. That wasn’t going to happen for the simple fact that I had the right of way.

    “The person exiting the building or room should proceed through the door or doorway before the person entering comes through.” -Rules of the Door.

    Ms feminazi stepped aside avoiding the collision her behavior was going to cause electing to stare down my retreating form with a look of pure malice instead. I would like to dedicate this song to it: https://youtu.be/cEuU64Zt4B0

  4. Boxer says:

    The biblical model has the utmost love for husbands and wives. The crossdressing model is perverted and features an insatiable craving for rebellion and suffering.

    The way you describe it recalls the phenomenon of a sexual fetish, like masochism, not just via an analogy, but in a real psychic sense. It’s as though these people are so given to perversity they’re probably unsalvageable; though your book suggests we shouldn’t give up hoping.

  5. Darwinian Arminian says:

    It must be noted that just as Christ loves and then allows us to respond, a man must enter that vacuum of sorts where he does not know how his wife is going to respond. He may be waiting a while, but if I remember, Christ patiently waited for us.

    The best part of a statement like this is that it allows you to see that the pastor his kicked Christ and His word off of the pedestal so that he can better practice his true religion: the worship of women. The notion that God sits aside patiently and waits for us to come to Him is at odds with instructions given more than once in scripture that tell us we have a finite amount of time to be reconciled to the Creator, and that if we miss that window we will be subject to His judgement. Think of Jesus’ parable of the ten virgins, in which he directly warned His followers against thinking that God would wait for them if they chose not to be ready for Him. This isn’t even an idea that’s foreign to those outside the church. Thomas Jefferson — who wasn’t exactly an orthodox Christian — probably summed it up best in his famous line, “I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just: that his justice cannot sleep for ever.”

    But Rev. Force is more than happy to convert a message of “Come to God before it’s too late” to a more upbeat declaration of, “Jesus is happy to wait for you!” Why? Because saying it that way will give permission to the women to keep on doing whatever they want. And the women are who he serves.

  6. TMAC says:

    Reminds me of the tried and true line most often heard from weak pulpits…. “If men would lead correctly – the wife would gladly submit.” What they mean is (to other husbands), “If you were as good of a husband as I am – you’d have a submitted wife.” What they mean (to wives) is, “Too bad your husband isn’t great like me.”

  7. bdash 77 says:

    @TMAC
    yup
    one of our Pastors said the better and more often a husband cooks lunch and dinner the more submissive the wife…

  8. Robert What? says:

    I feel bad for these believing husbands who soak up these messages and internalize them. Hell to pay at home, Hell to pay at church. Why men continue to go to mainstream churches is a mystery to me.

  9. Once Woot says:

    “Rebellious wives are cherished because only then can the husband truly be made to suffer in his submission.”

    Flipping this to a positive? “Only a submissive wife and suffering can bring her husband to be an amazing leader”.

    Just a quick note – my marriage has been saved by Jesus/Dalrock/Proverbs.
    I lost a bunch of cash (less than divorce I figure) and my house – and now a miscarriage – we are trying for our second child. God willing we will have a son. She loves to tease me with whenever we’re at a crossroad with “whatever daddy says we do”.

  10. TMAC says:

    Here’s my main issue: You can say all you want to a husband PRIVATELY, “Hey man, there’s no shame in helping out around the house. If your wife is sick, do the dishes, laundry, whatever… You can do those things and still be a manly-man.”

    The issue is that that mantra is proclaimed within earshot of all women and so know they now expect it (and anything else that they think comes close). If you say (in front of students), “Teachers, if you are a great teacher, you should identify struggling students and maybe give them a little extra help to succeed.” But guess what happens when you say that in front of the students? They begin saying, “It’s the teacher’s fault I’m failing – blame them.”

    Pastors likewise proudly tell COUPLES everywhere that husbands should be willing to serve/sacrifice (and that is true) but they have said it so indiscriminately (without an equal admonition to wife’s about submission) that women everywhere think they can hold their husbands accountable for not being “loving” enough.

    “Yeah… that’s right.. when you love me better, I’ll submit.” And “better” is like the old quote attributed to J. Paul Getty when he was asked how much money would be enough…… “Just a little bit more.”

  11. Pingback: Their love for crossdressing is sincere. | Reaction Times

  12. Swanny River says:

    Dalrock,
    Thanks for your thoughts, it’s the kind of sharpening that is sweet to one’s life. I agree that the power motive didn’t sit easy within me. However, I still can’t accept the alternative. I don’t disagree, but can’t get over what it means that if elders and pastors truly love the new model. If they love it, then how little brotherly love they have. Putting a millstone on me and effectively giving my wife over to rebellion and not presenting her an opportunity to repent is a cold and fruitless faith.

  13. DrTorch says:

    Another post w/ 100% spot on observations.

    There is a barely hidden giddiness that comes out when modern Christians speak of men submitting to their wives, and especially men suffering because of their rebellious wives,

    Oh so true. They delight in it. Perhaps b/c they struggle w/ issues and don’t want the flock to pass them by.

    It must be noted that just as Christ loves and then allows us to respond, a man must enter that vacuum of sorts where he does not know how his wife is going to respond. He may be waiting a while,

    Of course don’t put a time limit on it, b/c if you keep it indefinite, you can control people more, and if you’re published, on radio, or do seminars, you keep them coming back.

    Part of this is b/c the Church is afraid of the Dominion Mandate. What does it mean in modern times? Will we go overboard and sin by taking too much dominion? Will be let the conquest become idols? All valid questions, but the response has been to run away in fear, and ignore this direct command from God.

    This is relevant, b/c the church moves forward toward dominion w/ bold, energetic, focused men. Men who have large families who expand Christendom.

    It shrivels with henpecked, beta males who use all of their energy trying to keep their fat, psychopathic wives from thrashing them within inches of their lives. The church is impotent when men surrender their capital and earnings to divorce theft. It shrinks when men are too exhausted and too disrespected to raise their sons to follow their leads as men of God. And this is how church leaders want it so they aren’t ever forced to address dominion.

  14. Mike says:

    We need to create a list of churches that are redpill approved. Taking your wife to church can totally ruin your marriage now.

  15. UK Fred says:

    @ Mike

    That will be a short list.

  16. Hose_B says:

    I’m sure Satan was giddy when he was convincing Eve to eat the fruit. We shouldn’t be surprised to see giddiness when people serve his purpose.

    They want to steal your wives (serpent/eve) then steal your soul (either by getting you to follow your wife or by destroying you in the meat grinder)

  17. DrTorch says:

    Taking your wife to church can totally ruin your marriage now.

    *Nods sorrowfully*

    They want to steal your wives (serpent/eve) then steal your soul (either by getting you to follow your wife or by destroying you in the meat grinder)

    Exactly right.

    While it was never my favorite, for some reason I kept seeing or reading Lewis’ The Silver Chair. What is interesting is the strategy seen there, the plan to undermine Narnia (quite literally in the book) all starts with taking out the Queen. Eliminate the wife/mother and the nation becomes vulnerable.

  18. BillyS says:

    No perfect church exists. It would not be perfect once you were there.

    This is more of an issue of keeping your own eyes open and building a good relationship with your wife. Not the one many Christian leaders falsely claim, but one where you are working with your wife to overcome the world. You can’t ignore her and what she faces and accomplish that.

    Dalrock has lots of notes about what his wife says and married men need to figure out ways to notice and cultivate things like that.

  19. Damn Crackers says:

    How much of this is just the “Iron Law of Oligarchy”? Aren’t these preachers just playing to their audience? I imagine most of their flock are hens. So to keep your position as cock-of-the-walk, you give the mainly female congregation what they want not what they need.

  20. feeriker says:

    Damn Crackers says:
    March 2, 2018 at 9:19 am

    Yes, exactly. As I and several others here continue to assert, no church headed by a professional churchian hireling can speak truth and keep its doors open. Tickling itchy ears is the only way to keep collection plates full.

  21. Gunner Q says:

    “Tickling itchy ears is the only way to keep collection plates full.”

    You’d think some of those clergy would try at least occasionally to reach the other half of humanity. It’s a big group, too.

  22. feeriker says:

    You’d think some of those clergy would try at least occasionally to reach the other half of humanity. It’s a big group, too.

    Even if only subconsciously, their actions are an admission that they subscribe to the worldly belief that women hold all ultimate power and that God’s design has been defeated. They’ve effectively apostacized thir faith, which means that no believer should be giving them the time of day.

  23. BillyS says:

    I am not convinced of that explanation. I have known too many in the ministry that did not have that in the picture at all. They were just stupid in that area and failed to correct themselves. Perhaps it was just well hidden, but I think MPAI (most people are idiots) explains it just fine, so I will stick with that.

  24. Scott says:

    BillyS-

    After it takes hold, it almost starts to have a life within her all its own.

    Yesterday Mychael was somewhere and the service was bad. (It was homeschool/field trip related thing, not something trivial like a restaurant or something). She ended up not being satisfied and apparently said to the manager “I am really picky about what I spend my husbands money on.”

    This was within ear shot of the larger group (and most importantly, my daughter).

    She (Mychael) seems to go out of her way to find opportunities like that, because she has internalized sweetness, submissiveness, etc. It’s humbling to be honest.

  25. BillyS says:

    After it takes hold, it almost starts to have a life within her all its own.

    I would agree. The bad ideas must be actively opposed or they dig in and grow. The dominant culture will have an impact on any church. That is why the Amish (for example) can resist some things, they keep out the dominant culture.

    Living in a culture means we must always watch we are not controlled, even subtly, by that culture. Too many Christians today have failed that test, and not in the way many think.

  26. anonymous_ng says:

    https://mountainguerrilla.wordpress.com/2018/02/28/courage-is-a-choice/

    An interesting piece with relevance to our moral discussions.

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