The new face of complementarian feminism

I’ve been writing this week about complementarian (covert) feminist Mary Kassian, a Women’s Studies professor at the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary.  Kassian is a council member of the CBMW and was involved with its founding.  She also contributes fairly regularly to The Gospel Coalition (TGC), another flagship complementarian organization.  But Kassian is the old guard of complementarian feminists.  I don’t say this to minimize her work in bringing feminism to Christianity.  She has worked tirelessly for decades in this regard, and she has had great success.  I suspect we can even give her at least partial credit for convincing the CBMW to invent the feminist sin of servility in their founding document.  But Kassian’s work has been mostly about consolidating the gains overt Christian feminists made in the 60s, 70s, and 80s, and nurturing these ideas in complementarianism.  She has also of course trained up the new guard of complementarian feminists in her role as a Women’s Studies professor.

But the old guard paves the way for the new guard, and the new guard of complementarian feminists are women like Jen Wilkin.  While Kassian periodically contributes to TGC,  Wilkin is a formal contributor at TGC and also publishes books under their banner.  Wilkin is also a minister working for Pastor Matt Chandler, President of the Acts 29 network.

As a member of the old guard, Kasian is careful to distance herself from the label feminist and focuses on undermining headship and stoking feminist resentment.  But because of the progress women like Kassian have made over the decades, a new guard of complementarian women like Wilkin can afford to be quite open in their feminism (even if they avoid outright calling themselves feminist) and focus on the same issues as secular feminists.  As the old guard stomps out the last embers of complementarian headship and submission, the new guard can focus on agitating for affirmative action for women in leadership roles.

For example, in let not the men keep silent* Wilkin repurposes a viral feminist letter by a white knight complaining about supposed barriers to women in engineering.  She very openly applies secular feminist activism in her role as a complementarian (emphasis mine):

Jared understands what I wish more men in ministry understood. In the ongoing discussion about whether women in complementarian churches are actually treated with the equal value that Genesis 1 bestows on them, it is time for men to speak up on behalf of their sisters. We women can tell our shared stories to whomever may listen, but our concerns won’t likely draw notice until our brothers perceive their validity, take them to heart, and speak them as their own. As long as women are the ones speaking them, we are easy to dismiss as complainers or (gasp) feminists.

Jared Mauldin had eyes to see the stereotypes and gender bias that plague women who venture into fields where “they don’t belong”. What he observed plays out in its own ways in churches, as well. Church staffs, like most male-heavy environments, often unwittingly perpetuate boy’s club mentalities, harmful gender stereotypes and tokenism. I and other women have occasionally donned protective gear and written on it.

In More Pressing than Women Preachers, Wilkin explains that she isn’t focused on convincing fellow complementarians to accept women preachers because she is too busy pushing for more women into every other leadership role in the church:

Once again the internet has been abuzz with discussions of whether women should preach in the local church gathering. Whenever the issue is raised, those who oppose it are quick to explain that the role is not withheld from women because they are less valuable than men. And that “equal value” assertion always shifts my eyes from the pulpit to a more pressing concern. As some continue to debate the presence of women in the pulpit, we must not miss this immediate problem: the marked absence of women in areas of church leadership that are open to them.

The women e-mailing me regularly are not worried about winning the pulpit. They’re still facing opposition over teaching the Bible to other women. They are fighting to be seen as necessary beyond children’s ministry and women’s ministry. They are fighting to contribute more than hospitality or a soft voice on the praise team. They are looking for leadership trajectories for women in the local church and finding virtually nothing. They watch their brothers receive advocacy and wonder who will invite them and equip them to lead well. If the contributions of women are equally valued in the church, shouldn’t we see some indication in the way we staff?…

…The sisters among us are wondering when we’ll be able to tangibly demonstrate equal value in the local church, not just affirm this value with our words.

Elsewhere Wilkin explains the need for complementarian pastors to not permit women to take on leadership roles, but to pursue them for leadership roles.  In The Complementarian Woman: Permitted or Pursued? Wilkin explains that the Apostle Paul set a disturbing tone among Christians that needs to be corrected:

I am not certain when it became common to speak of permitting rather than pursuing women to serve, but I admit that it grieves me. Yes, there is that well-worn verse in 1 Timothy, but it seems a shame to let one occurrence of a term dominate our language and practice. It may be that permission vocabulary persists because of the unfortunate woman-as-usurper stereotype that sometimes underlies complementarian thought.

She suggests that if there was more affirmative action for women in leadership, Christian feminists might stop rebelling:

I have to think that egalitarians would grow quieter in their critiques if we could point to more women within our ranks who convincingly demonstrate equal, complementary value in our churches.

Feminist progress is after all a reflection of men having the courage to lead:

Do you desire to leverage the equal complementary value of women in your church? Don’t give us a chance to ask permission. Get out ahead of us. You approach us with what you intend to empower us to do. End the culture of permission and you will dispel the stigma of submission. We are not usurpers, we are the possessors of every capacity you lack and the celebrators of every capacity you possess.

Brothers, don’t permit us. Pursue us. 

*The title is an obvious jab at 1 Cor 14:34Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.”  –KJV

This entry was posted in Acts 29, Complementarian, Council on Biblical Manhood and Womanhood, Feminist Territory Marking, Feminists, Jen Wilkin, Mary Kassian, Pastor Matt Chandler, Social Justice Warriors, The Gospel Coalition. Bookmark the permalink.

153 Responses to The new face of complementarian feminism

  1. Pingback: The new face of complementarian feminism | Neoreactive

  2. Pingback: The new face of complementarian feminism – Manosphere.com

  3. HamOnRye says:

    Without a doubt, Christian theologians a hundred years will be writing about the American Church as another of the Great Heresies. That’s some seriously bad company.

  4. pancakeloach says:

    “I have to think that egalitarians would grow quieter in their critiques if we could point to more women within our ranks who convincingly demonstrate equal, complementary value in our churches.”

    Classic SJW entryism tactic. Since when has any egalitarian anywhere ever stopped whining after receiving what they asked for? They’ve always got some new complaint, one more concession they desire in the name of “fairness”…

  5. Carlotta says:

    Much of her writing is a desperate attempt for attention from men she is not married to.

    She demands that men, in general, seek out random women in the church and meet their emotional needs and do everything possible to get those women to expose themselves to the men emotionally, even if they are reluctant to do so. She further demands that women be pursued, similar in fashion to a husband pursuing his own wife (her words), into leading in the church. Telling her she can is not enough, she wants to be romance into it…or perhaps worshiped.

    These are all completely inappropriate and not even remotely Biblical.
    I was not surprised upon seeing her picture that she is a plain women.

    I hate to say it, but these people that Dalrock has been researching are looking like a bunch of FREAKS.

  6. Carlotta says:

    “I have to think that egalitarians would grow quieter in their critiques if we could point to more women within our ranks who convincingly demonstrate equal, complementary value in our churches.”

    Why does it never occur to them to swell the ranks of the church by having and raising Godly children and seeking and holding the distinguished titles of Wife, Mother and the Grand Dame of them all…Grandma?

  7. Will S. says:

    Meet the new (would-be) boss; same as the old (would-be) boss, in all ways that matter…

    Keep up the good work, Dalrock, in shining a harsh spotlight on these heretics…

  8. Paniym says:

    What do you think will bring back the patriarchy in the Church? All this discussion and argument is worthless. It will only be by hardship where woman’s delusions can be crushed. Then and only then will they bow the knee (and bow their pride) before the throne of God. Their pride is unstoppable. And it doesn’t seem to endear men to them either. They see men (especially in the church) very weak and generally incompetent.

  9. freebird says:

    “verse in 1 Timothy, but it seems a shame ”

    Yes,yes we must shame the patriarchy and those Evil
    patriarchal Bible Verses.
    All hail mother/master and leader lillith.
    Adam’s (real) master
    according to FI.
    Kneel before the usurpers.
    (yeah right, chucklef*cks)
    Blasphemy,it’s not just for breakfast anymore…

  10. infowarrior1 says:

    Egalitarianism is the tool of the envious to beat their superiors with.

  11. greyghost says:

    What do you think will bring back the patriarchy in the Church?

    Blue pill sinners kicking their ass. And men speaking the truth and making a biblical church for those sinners to turn red pill men. As long as the blue pill mindset lives there is no stopping it. The connection between red pill and the bible is starting to be made by of all people CH. https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2016/03/04/more-game-in-the-bible-choice-quotes/

  12. bkilbour says:

    Dang. Makes me want to go minister to the Amish.
    “Women as usurpers” – ha! They want control with a veneer of hypoagency, something I’ve seen in my own church. Trust me, if they had the kind of control they say they want, they’d be miserable – who would they complain to? And when the church is run into the ground, bankrupt, and the pews empty, who could they possibly blame? No, they want to complain about having no control, but they want men to tell them “no;” then they relish complaining more.
    Happened to the Episcopalians – to quote Vox Day, “women ruin everything.”

  13. bkilbour says:

    That is, the Episcopalians gave in and it ruined a whole lot of their churches.

  14. PM says:

    My wife is being “pursued” for a women’s ministry. She says that she is a submissive wife because she tells me what she wants and then does whatever I decide. That much is true, but if I decide on other than what she wants she feels sad or disappointed and then tries to “win me over without a word”. This means avoiding me and spending more time with friends and family and not talking to me much when we are together. When I ask her why she isn’t talking much she says it is to avoid the temptation of arguing with me. She won’t turn me down for sex, but instead tells me she is not in the mood but will do it if I want to. Not giving her what she wants means loneliness, less affection and starfish sex.

    Technically she is obedient but this isn’t something that she needs to be teaching other women. I am not against women teaching women in general. However I believe that the woman’s husband should be the one overseeing her teaching. A woman who isn’t pleasing to her own husband shouldn’t be teaching others.

  15. Women ruin everything…..if men let them.

    FTFY

  16. Anonymous Reader says:

    This is as good a place as any to drop the news. Federal racketeering suit filed, Mark Driscoll named.

    http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/mark-driscoll-accused-of-racketeering-at-mars-hill-church/

  17. Emily says:

    I’m not very familiar with these organizations / churches or their preachers and teachers. They obviously have a lot of influence over many people. It seems to me that Scripture is being twisted every which way and not just by women. Self promotion is the order of the day and large amounts of money are often at stake. It’s all so far removed from the gospel itself. It’s terrible to see God’s Word being manipulated to further the ends of people who don’t care a thing about the truth of the gospel.

  18. feeriker says:

    Why does it never occur to them to swell the ranks of the church by having and raising Godly children and seeking and holding the distinguished titles of Wife, Mother and the Grand Dame of them all…Grandma?

    What they’ll never openly admit (at least not yet), but what through their words, deeds, and actions they clearly believe is that the traditional family unit is a reactionary patriarchal relic that oppresses women and keeps them from “using their true gifts.”

    As I can never repeat often enough, I really wish these people would just drop the pretense of biblical Christianity, stop insulting our collective intelligence, and declare themselves secular humanists, which in word and deed they’ve proved themselves to be.

  19. Pingback: The new face of complementarian feminism | Reaction Times

  20. Darwinian Arminian says:

    @Carlotta
    Much of her writing is a desperate attempt for attention from men she is not married to.

    That’s a good observation; in effect, she’s playing out the female version of the pastor who poses as The Only Real Man in the Room. He tries to improve his looks among the church’s women by using the sermon to cut down and bad-mouth the other men in the congregation, and she tries to encourage her appearance amongst the top alphas by creating a scriptural imperative for them to hunt her down, praise each of the many virtues that they find in her, and then fight to have the high honor of her serving with them on their team.

  21. Dave says:

    On another note, anybody watching Netflix’s “House of Cards, Season 4”?
    Lots of RedPill moments in there. Claire Underwood is being reminded at every turn that no matter how often she puffs up her chest and tries to play president, she would be nothing but a pretty face without her husband.

    OK, back to the regularly scheduled program…..

  22. Carlotta says:

    @feeriker

    “As I can never repeat often enough, I really wish these people would just drop the pretense of biblical Christianity, stop insulting our collective intelligence, and declare themselves secular humanists, which in word and deed they’ve proved

    The only reason I can think of that they don’t is that they are still fooling a bunch of people and bidding their time. What else can we do but call them out and separate ourselves?

    @Darwinian Arming an
    Ok, you said it way better then I could and expounded on it. Yes, that is what she is doing!

    Basically, she and Piper are trying to make church an emotional swingers club.

  23. Carlotta says:

    Sorry, the quote of feeriker got cut some how above. Should be
    “As I can never repeat often enough, I really wish these people would just drop the pretense of biblical Christianity, stop insulting our collective intelligence, and declare themselves secular humanists, which in word and deed they’ve proved themselves to be.”

  24. Carlotta says:

    And I apologize to Arminian Darwinian, my auto correct is going crazy.

  25. infowarrior1 says:

    Don’t forget the feminist translation of the NIV 2011:
    http://www.bible-researcher.com/cbmw.niv2011.2.pdf

    The only thing they got right so far.

  26. American says:

    It’s nice to see the anti-Christ movement of feminism laid bare in a single blog. It’s convenient. Thank you for all your hard work Dalrock. I continue to learn a great deal and when I want to refer back to something, it’s all right here.🙂.

  27. infowarrior1 says:

    ” that the traditional family unit is a reactionary patriarchal relic that oppresses women and keeps them from “using their true gifts.””

    Their problem is not with this but with God who commanded such a family unit. This is equivalent to saying that Christ is a Patriarchal oppressor of the church and keep his bride from “using her true gifts”

  28. Micha Elyi says:

    As I can never repeat often enough, I really wish these people would just drop the pretense of biblical Christianity…
    feeriker

    Jesus didn’t leave us a bible, He left us His body the Church. With the authority Jesus left His apostles and their successors, His one, holy, and universal Church compiled and authorized the Christian and Hebrew Scriptures for use by Christians as the bible.

    In the end, it all comes down to authority to teach what is the true Christian faith. Anyone who holds up a book* yet disregards the Church from which that book came has very little to rest on when someone else holds up the same book and reads it differently.

    *whether this book is the complete bible or a redacted one with missing books and passages.

  29. feeriker says:

    Their problem is not with this but with God who commanded such a family unit.

    True this. They just haven’t yet reached the stage of rebelliin and apostasy where they’re comfortable raising their middle fingers at God, so they have to blame someone/something else Give them time, though.

  30. theasdgamer says:

    “This means avoiding me and spending more time with friends and family and not talking to me much when we are together.”

    Dog training. Beat it with Dread.

  31. desiderian says:

    “Jared Mauldin”

    That name can’t be real, right? Someone’s getting trolled.

  32. Jen says:

    This woman seems to have a serious problem with reading comprehension…or, worse, submitting to the word of God. I genuinely hope, probably foolishly, that she’s just a bit thick. That’s a lot easier to deal with.:/

    Also, I cannot think of one church attended during my life where women had difficulty teaching Scripture (or, frankly, anything else…with the notable exception of homemaking skills) to other women, or where teaching the children is seen as a ‘low’ position. Not one, and I’ve gone to churches ranging from seriously goofball when I was a child to a couple, now that God has graciously and kindly opened my eyes, to Biblically solid! These things are seen as very important indeed.

    It would behoove all to trust in God’s commands, remembering He knows well what He is about, and to obey Him. *sad sigh*

  33. theasdgamer says:

    @ Carlotta

    Much of her writing is a desperate attempt for attention from men she is not married to.

    Kind of like women posting on a men’s blog.😉

    Likely, churchian women envy the bar sluts who get lots of attention from men. It’s not faaair!

  34. Swanny River says:

    Wow, I am really refreshed to see you as address TGC and Jen. Thank you.
    Because my pastor blogs there I was reading it regularly a few years ago, but I couldn’t handle so many aspects of it. Wanting to read meaningful biblical writing unlike the emotive and saltless discussions there was a factor in helping me find this website. People here express a desire for you to reach a larger audience but I humorously wonder what they (and I) would do if TGC offered you a spot on their roster. I used to read Joe Carter before he went to TGC, so it does happen. I don’t think I could handle the comment section if you went there. The commenters here are excellent and they’d be lost in a sea of hamster pellets and white night sword battles over there.

  35. Swanny River says:

    I like the question of why aren’t these women interested in growing the church through childbirth and motherhood. One of the discouraging things about TGC to me is how writing about God seems confused with godliness and how the multitude of women writers there seem so eager to be there and FIND “their voice.” Ithink one of many answers is that they don’t have time for kids after going to grad school and working for a few years. Seems like the entry level age for the husband market for a “strong” christian woman is 26 -28. There Dads are pushing them to be independent (I’m referring to christian Dads) before getting married. Then the two-year engagement and you are looking at a 6-8 year window for child raising. Because she put so much into getting a grad degree she feels like its the most godly choice to get back working,or in TGCs world, agitating for power and recognition. Dad rationalizes independence is godly because the daughter can bring money to the husband and culture and trining to the future kids. She thinks whatever but has moments of believing a job will honor her parents paying for college and honor God for giving her talents and gifts. Thats why a TGC congregation are flummoxed and angry when I say I think we discredit mothering at my church.

  36. Dave says:

    Some preachers are waking up and standing up to feminism.

  37. Carlotta says:

    @theasdgamer

    “Kind of like women posting on a men’s blog. ;)

    Likely, churchian women envy the bar sluts who get lots of attention from men. It’s not faaair!”

    Are you seriously accusing any women who posts here of this?

    I see you are a super big fan of Mary Kassin. Strange how bipolar her male defenders are.

  38. theasdgamer says:

    @ Carlotta

    I see you are a super big fan of Mary Kassin.

    No, silly girl, I don’t want a date. lol

  39. LeeLee says:

    I’m glad you’re talking about Jen Wilkin. She’s someone whose writing has tended to get “stuck” in my mind.

    On the one hand, she called publicly called out Tullian Tchividjian on his made up theology long before the affair and the divorce, while half the evangelical world was still fawning over him.

    On the other hand, she is so very HARD and SEVERE. I read the permitted versus pursued post, and another post called 3 Female Ghosts That Haunt The Church a long time ago and they’ve been stuck in my head for a long time like I said, because she’s quite good with theology in a lot of ways but quite bad with being feminine or respectful of masculinity.

    All that to say, I’m glad to have help processing her here outside of the Christian social media bubble.

  40. Anonymous Reader says:

    LeeLee
    I did a search on “3 Female Ghosts That Haunt The Church” and found this:

    http://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/3-female-ghosts-that-haunt-the-church

    Is this the article you are referring to?

  41. Trust says:

    Slightly related, but I’ve noticed a juxtaposition with the Christian women in my wife’s social circle, and women in general, that truly baffles me.

    On one hand, women give men in general a lot of grief for their ability to separate love from sex, they way they can have sex with a woman they care nothing about, and how that leaves women hurt. I understand this, especially as a man with sisters and daughters.

    However, on the other hand, these same women seem to demonstrate a remarkable ability to separate marriage from love, and from sex too, for that matter. The way women can stand before God, family and friends in a church and make a commitment to a man they really aren’t that attracted to. They then expect this man to honor his marital duties in the face of disrespect, a loveless, sexless marriage. If it’s wrong for a man to have sex with a woman he does not love, should it not also be wrong to marry a man one does not love and makes to live celebate?

    The man who was my best man, chosen because he is an exemplary godly husband and father, has not had sex in at least 3 years (and we know this because his wife has told my wife this, with a shrug and with no shame or guilt). Yet, she expects him to take all her wants seriously, otherwise he is the one unloving.

    D is wiser than I, so I’m sure he’s observed this phenominon. While I agree that men should not use woman for sex, at least that scenario isn’t legally backed by the state for decades. That isn’t so with men used for resources.

  42. theasdgamer says:

    @ Trust

    The man who was my best man, chosen because he is an exemplary godly husband

    Your “best man” may be a good man, but he also needs to be good at being a man. Putting up with a sexless marriage for three years shows that he isn’t good at being a man. Been there, done that, I worked on self-improvement and no more sexless marriage.

  43. Swanny River says:

    Lee Lee and AR, thanks for the 3 Ghosts article and link. Against good judgment I read it and the first 20 or so comments. It’s the comments that stab my heart at TGC. I expect a Christian gloss to wordly thinking from the writers but then the readers just love it with such sickening enthusiasm. 70 comments for that one. And that is from the best America protestants have to offer. Really, I feel so isolated when I go there that I have to be careful about it. Seems like a huge majority of readers can’t get enough of the drivel and so it has the effect of making me think there must be something wrong with me that I have such a strong negative reaction to it.

  44. Swanny River says:

    I saw Jen’s bio at the 3 Ghosts link. 4 kids and she lives in Texas. I guess that shuts me up. She has kids and a career so I guess I should just go crawl in my headship hole and suck it. University Reformed Church is probably behind her four square. She’s godly and submissive and what I should want my son to meet and marry I suppose. There goes my answer to Carlotta that some of these women don’t focus on kids is because of schooling and career narrowing the window. Apparently Jen has it all covered and no doubt has a husband who gets more sex than me and sincerely think she’s great.

  45. Trust says:

    @theasdgamer says:

    Your “best man” may be a good man, but he also needs to be good at being a man. Putting up with a sexless marriage for three years shows that he isn’t good at being a man. Been there, done that, I worked on self-improvement and no more sexless marriage.
    ___________________

    False. Dalrock has been warning about this a lot lately, that a woman’s desire to have sex with her husband is the gauge of how much of a man he is.

    Every post about female wrongdoing seems to inevitably turns to a discussion about male inadequacies. If the dynamic works as you suggests, the bible would have needed to tell women to submit to, respect, and not defraud their husbands.

  46. Trust says:

    Correction: If the dynamic worked as you suggest, the bible would not have needed to tell women to submit to, respect, and not defraud their husbands.

  47. Gunner Q says:

    “We are not usurpers, we are the possessors of every capacity you lack and the celebrators of every capacity you possess.”

    Name one.

    Micha Elyi @ 3:31 am:
    “In the end, it all comes down to authority to teach what is the true Christian faith.”

    So you support this feminist? She was definitely given authority over men by God (because He appoints all human authority) and we have no ability to say she does evil except a stupid old book says so, a book that must be wrong because it says YOUR leaders do evil, too. But perhaps True Power comes from a funny hat and fancy bathrobes, not boobs, even though following boobs is the greatest Church Tradition of all. Goes back to Adam.

    “Anyone who holds up a book yet disregards the Church from which that book came has very little to rest on when someone else holds up the same book and reads it differently.”

    Are you claiming this woman is following the Bible? As the OP quotes, “Yes, there is that well-worn verse in 1 Timothy, but it seems a shame to let one occurrence of a term dominate our language and practice.” She is not reading the Bible differently, she is openly rebelling against the Bible, and you use her rebellion to fault us Protestants for following the Bible.

    Swanny River @ 1:02 pm:
    “I like the question of why aren’t these women interested in growing the church through childbirth and motherhood.”

    Women grow the Church by respecting and following their husbands. Children are one way to keep wives busy at home but not the only way and the Great Commission calls for evangelism, not spawning.

    Christianity is not an ethnic group. The numbers don’t matter if the religion isn’t practiced. That’s how we got here.

  48. theasdgamer says:

    @ Trust

    Dalrock has also been warning men to use Soft Dread, which I did. Can’t blame it all on women. Your friend is a loser and you’d be better off finding other friends.

  49. theasdgamer says:

    Betas like Trust need to learn how to read the Bible. Read my posts about Song of Solomon for Game/relationship advice.

  50. greyghost says:

    Dread is your friend

  51. Miserman says:

    I have to think that egalitarians would grow quieter in their critiques if we could point to more women within our ranks who convincingly demonstrate equal, complementary value in our churches.

    So tell me again what the difference between complimentarian and egalatarian is, because I can’t tell.

  52. theasdgamer says:

    @ Miserman

    Complementarians say that it’s Ok for a woman to be submissive if they want to. But women like that don’t get the star on the He Man Merit Badge.

  53. Trust says:

    @theasdgamer says:
    March 5, 2016 at 3:57 pm
    Dalrock has also been warning men to use Soft Dread, which I did. Can’t blame it all on women. Your friend is a loser and you’d be better off finding other friends.
    _______

    He is no loser, but you are a jerk and Dalrock deserves better followers.

  54. Trust says:

    theasdgamer says:
    March 5, 2016 at 3:58 pm
    Betas like Trust need to learn how to read the Bible. Read my posts about Song of Solomon for Game/relationship advice.
    _________________

    Ahh. So you’re a RealMan(TM).

  55. theasdgamer says:

    @ greyghost

    If he won’t listen to Solomon, he won’t listen even if a marriage rises from the dead.

  56. theasdgamer says:

    @ Trust

    The Red Pill is hard to swallow. No way to make it easier. Telling the truth often makes people look like jerks. Think of the One who called hypocrites “whitewashed tombs”. I’m sure they thought Jesus was a jerk, too.

  57. Trust says:

    @theasdgamer

    You are so off base and out of line it is almost funny. I’m a believer in the Red Pill. If you actually read coherently, you would have seen where I rejected this ridiculous notion that women are attracted to godly men. That’s a red pill notion, that women are attracted to the worst sorts of men. This is why women are cautioned against defrauding their husbands. Nothing I have said agrees in any way with complementarianism.

    You call my best man, one of the best men I know, a loser based solely on the fact that he has a rebellious wife. That doesn’t make you a bastion of the truth, just a jerk no better than the complementarians who preach from the pulpit that the tingle is the gauge of a man’s value.

    I don’t think I’m an alpha. but you don’t know jack about me except I have a best friend in a sexless marriage. I don’t know anything about you expect that here you like to beat your chest and act like the alphiest alpha, but i don’t see much that would impress anyone.

    Dalrock does a great service. Try to show a little bit of respect, and try discussing issues rather than right out of the gate calling people you don’t know betas and losers.

  58. theasdgamer says:

    @ Trust

    I meant to call you Blue Pill, not beta.

    You think you are Red Pill, but actually you are not. Your friend puts up with a sexless marriage for three years? lol, that’s absurd. And he’s one of the best men you know??? Seriously??? That’s so sad. You need to get in some different social circles ASAP.

    I understand your loyalty. But you need to make sure that people deserve your loyalty. “Bad company corrupts good morals.”

  59. LSDGamer thinks he knows absolutely everything there is to know about marriage and tingles. He’s head has swollen to unimaginable sizes. He will use the Song of Solomon to bash men over the head with, knowing full well it’s a song about infatuation, lust and a KING above all. In no way useful for a comparison to the everyman Joe.

    However, your friend needs to put his foot down. Learn to use dread accordingly and treat his wife as she treats him. Until such point, she will never learn to treat him with respect. She needs this just as much as him.

  60. theasdgamer says:

    @ greyghost

    Trust pontificated, sniffing: “i don’t see much that would impress anyone. ”

    See? I told you he wouldn’t listen even if a marriage rose from the dead. And he sure doesn’t give a shit about the Bible, including Solomon.

  61. theasdgamer says:

    Scripture-twisting feministhater aka “Wormtongue” scribbled:

    He will use the Song of Solomon to bash men over the head with, knowing full well it’s a song about infatuation, lust and a KING above all

    Of course, at the beginning, the woman doesn’t know that her lover is the king. She thinks that he’s just a low-status shepherd. You’re not very skilled at reading, are you?

  62. LeeLee says:

    @Anonymous Reader — that’s it!

  63. greyghost says:

    theasgamer
    What Trust can do is teach his friend some red pill.. The situation he describes is common and is a good opportunity for the men here to go over ways to actually help those type of men. It would be interesting for everyone including Trust.

  64. greyghost says:

    Trust pontificated, sniffing: “i don’t see much that would impress anyone. ”

    See? I told you he wouldn’t listen even if a marriage rose from the dead. And he sure doesn’t give a shit about the Bible, including Solomon.

    No he isn’t going to lick your ass here after the way you posted to him.

  65. patchasaurus says:

    theasgamer:
    You are being a jackass. Instead of trying to humiliate a brother and win, why don’t you try to be of service or just shut up. Shutting up is often the most red pill action.

  66. RICanuck says:

    @asdgamer

    The jump in with free advice and insults only works in a blue collar or military face-to-face environment where team work is essential,because the work is difficult an often dangerous. The new guys get ragged, insulted and browbeaten. But they either leave or become part of the team.

    This is the manosphere team, and just jumping in with the insults and free advice only get men’s backs up.

  67. RICanuck says:

    @Luck

    You violated Rollo Tomassi’s Iron Rule #1 – Frame.

    You walked into asdgamer’s frame, and left your own. He should have been ignored or gamed. You are trying to live red pill, so you know you have to game the women in your life, and if you choose to respond, game asdgamer. He was looking for a BSD contest, and you should not have given him one.

  68. Anon says:

    Haha!

    Sweden now says men should have abortion rights or at least opt-out rights :

    http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/228331/#respond

    Unsurprisingly, ‘feminists’ and cuckservatives are united in their opposition to this. But it seems only fair. There really is no basis via which to obstruct this idea..

    Cuckservatives will fight tooth and nail against this, since they already think that abortion only ever happens due to the man doing something wrong, hence the way to reduce abortions is to punish *men*.

  69. Novaseeker says:

    The jump in with free advice and insults only works in a blue collar or military face-to-face environment where team work is essential,because the work is difficult an often dangerous. The new guys get ragged, insulted and browbeaten. But they either leave or become part of the team.

    This is the manosphere team, and just jumping in with the insults and free advice only get men’s backs up.

    Yes, although in some places (notably the red pill subreddit and Rollo’s comment section (not his actual posts/essays, of course)) in the manosphere people are actively trying to recreate that kind of environment, and I suspect that is what is being attempted here as well.

  70. 1 Timothy 2:12(various translations)
    New International Version
    I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet.

    New Living Translation
    I do not let women teach men or have authority over them. Let them listen quietly.

    English Standard Version
    I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet.

    Berean Study Bible
    I do not permit a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man; she is to remain quiet.

    Berean Literal Bible
    However, I do not permit a woman to teach, nor to use authority over a man, but to be in quietness.

    New American Standard Bible
    But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet.

    King James Bible
    But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

    The Bible practices what it preaches, as there is not one female writer of the New Testament. Not one.

    Matthew
    Mark
    Luke
    John
    The Acts
    Romans
    First and Second Corinthians
    Galatians
    Ephesians
    Philippians
    Colossians
    First and Second Thessalonians
    First and Second Timothy
    Titus
    Philemon
    Hebrews
    James
    First and Second Peter
    First, Second and Third John
    Jude
    Revelation

    So the Scripture is crystal clear in both concept and application. Women are indeed gifted with prophetics, teaching, finances and other gifts; that is also in the New Testament, but the Bible is clear that women are supposed to only serve while in submission to male authority. Father, husband, Pastor, or all three. They are not to be out there on their own, uncovered, in an unsubmitted state, nor are they ever supposed to be leading men. The end.

  71. Vektor says:

    “Feminist progress is after all a reflection of men having the courage to lead”

    Feminist “progress” is the progress of degeneracy.
    Men don’t need the courage to lead…they need the authority to lead

    Gee whiz….what do you mean? Until divorce rape ends and a shared parenting law is common law in the states, men won’t have any authority. They will rely on status….that is…..if the douche bag wife can’t do any better….then….maybe you get to keep your kids. Hopefully your economic situation doesn’t change. Let me get this straight….my kids are “mine”, as long as I can afford them………

    I would bet money and more that Jesus would not agree with this system.

  72. Pingback: Wintery Knight and Dalrock show how feminist, i.e. sold out to the world, The Gospel Coalition is | Patriactionary

  73. Magnus says:

    I don’t read here a lot, so I would appreciate someone enlightening me: How is what CBMW teaches any different from egalitarianism? I mean, when I read this:

    “I have to think that egalitarians would grow quieter in their critiques if we could point to more women within our ranks who convincingly demonstrate equal, complementary value in our churches.”

    I assume it to mean: “I have to think that egalitarians would grow quieter in their critiques if we could [just like them].”

    The word egalitarian has the word ‘equal’ as the root (we get it from the French word égalité). So when she writes, “equal, complementary,” well… which is it? If these words mean the same thing, then egalitarianism and complementarianism must be, in essence, the same thing.

    Or am I too simplistic?

  74. Dave says:

    If these words mean the same thing, then egalitarianism and complementarianism must be, in essence, the same thing.

    Absolutely. Two items cannot be complementary unless they are implicitly equal in quality and importance. The Ying must be as good as the Yang for both to be complementary.
    God is not interested in equality, but in hierarchy. The very structure of the Universe requires and thrives on a hierarchical arrangement. Other than this equality nonsense being peddled by feminists, there is no other relationship among humans or angels where hierarchy is not in evidence. Among equally powerful Senators on Capitol Hill, there is still a Senate Majority Leader and a Senate Minority Leader. Angels are innumerable, but we know about Gabriel and Michael the archangels.

  75. Dave says:

    The Bible practices what it preaches, as there is not one female writer of the New Testament. Not one.

    Nay, I don’t know of ONE female writer of the Bible. God repeatedly gave orders for men to “write in a book”, but never gave such an order to a woman, because that is not her job.

  76. Of course, at the beginning, the woman doesn’t know that her lover is the king. She thinks that he’s just a low-status shepherd. You’re not very skilled at reading, are you?

    It’s called infatuation, your reading more into the Song is what is causing the trouble. Stop pontificating, you’re not God.

    Oh, and your calling me a ‘worm tongue’ or whatever won’t work. I’m not talking for God, only for myself, I’m not the one who says there is some great meaning in words that only I get and can preach about. I say what they mean at face value.

    You really think you are so better than every man here. I don’t think so, you’re just a pompous dick who thinks he knows everything but will learn in time.

  77. scientivore says:

    I’m sure there’s a difference between Churchian “complementarian” and BDSM “topping from the bottom,” but I can’t for the life of me tell what.

  78. Mark says:

    @Dalrock

    Nice Post Mr.’D’. One of the things that I see that you are missing about this Mary Kassian is that she is a Canadian broad! This speaks VOLUMES in itself!

    @Anon Reader

    Driscoll looking at RICO charges? Too funny! Those types of charges are usually reserved for Mafia Bosses.At least he is in good company!

  79. Carlotta says:

    @theasdgamer

    So you just like to make random, rude, and baseless accusations and when called on it run and hide? Noted. I see you have been on a roll on this thread. It is always helpful to know who to simply scroll past.

    “No, silly girl, I don’t want a date. lol”

    So you are a nut job then.
    Noted.

  80. Carlotta says:

    @Swanny River
    That is the new thing and I have experienced it in real life. They are getting push back against childless spinsters leading all the women’s ministries so they actively began recruiting women already married and with children. I noticed this about 20 years ago happening to a lot of the young mothers in churches and bible studies.
    The pastors wives were all getting a theology degree too so they could “better co-pastor”.

    They took young wives and moms and convinced them they have gifts that give a special anointing where they are so much more then some housewife and mother. Told the husband he needs to share the wife’s gift with the church, in fact…..they should go into debt and get a theology degree. Then, because they have a theology degree, a husband and kids in daycare……boom they are now qualified to lead all the women’s ministries. Kind of like Pastors. A degree trumps the actual qualifications in the Bible.

    Only now that they are in ministry, who doesn’t like to get ahead? Well now we have some pesky Bible verses that your gender limits you. We all know that isn’t fair and since we already changed “keeper at home” to “women who sometimes keeps her houseclean” and Proverbs 31 from being a king’s mother’s wish list for a future queen to an actual command for women to have careers and be in business ( personally been taught that by several different preachers) all we have to do is get rid of that whole gender thing now.

    Ohh, I know! It was cultural and there is now no one jew nor greek!
    So on to the romancing of women with ministry gifts like the women in the OP demands.

  81. Novaseeker says:

    God is not interested in equality, but in hierarchy.

    Indeed, finally something you have written that I can agree with.

    The entire problem results not only from the faulty reading of Genesis, which this community discussed a few posts ago, but also from a false or at least inadequate understanding of the Trinity.

    God is a symphony of hierarchic love, expressed in the Trinity. The Trinity is strictly hierarchal (Father as arche, Son as begotten, Spirit as proceeding (whether one adheres to the Catholic/Western view or the Orthodox/Eastern one)). There is a clear hierarchy, but it is a hierarchy of love. The two “concepts” are actively lived out in the divine Trinity itself every second of every day.

    In our age of rebellion, humans have a hard time reconciling hierarchy and love, due to sin on everyone’s part. But hierarchy-in-love is the Christian concept of life, stemming directly from the divine example. Equality, egalitarianism, complementarianism are all human hedges stemming from the fear of hierarchy-in-love, in terms of sinful humans being unable to live that out properly. But it remains the model and exemplar, and what we all *should* be living out, in imitation of God. Anything else is not even close to what we are called to do.

  82. feeriker says:

    The pastors wives were all getting a theology degree too so they could “better co-pastor”.

    One of the loudest TTL (“time to leave”) signals any church can broadcast.

    Told the husband he needs to share the wife’s gift with the church, in fact…..they should go into debt and get a theology degree.

    I never cease to be amaz3d at the hypocrisy of preachers who rail from the pulpit against debt – until they decide the church needs something it can’t live without (e.g., a new mega-building, a new sound system, a two-week trip to Las Vegas for an “evangelical conference,” etc.), in which case no amount of debt is too onerous, no sacrifice too unbearable, and no amount of shaming for those who resist contributing too harsh and uncalled for.

  83. theasdgamer says:

    @ greyghost

    What Trust can do is teach his friend some red pill.. The situation he describes is common and is a good opportunity for the men here to go over ways to actually help those type of men. It would be interesting for everyone including Trust.

    Trust has a long way to go to become significantly Red Pill. He needs to help himself before he can help others. Me calling his friend a “loser” was simply telling the truth. I was a loser when I went five years without sex in my marriage. Big deal. I got better. It’s not smart to hang around with losers. They will drag you down.

    Trust and others need to read TheRationalMale.com and not just dalrock. Dalrock doesn’t go into a lot of Red Pill stuff that men need. I even read comments by assumedly godly men (e.g., Greg Eliot) over at Heartiste, which is another site I read. Shock!

  84. theasdgamer says:

    All: If you are a Gameophobe, you are still heavily Blue Pill.

  85. Trust says:

    @theasgame

    You are STILL bringing me up in posts and beating your chest? Maybe I’m not the low rank male here.

  86. Jack Russell Terrorist says:

    Mark:
    Nice Post Mr.’D’. One of the things that I see that you are missing about this Mary Kassian is that she is a Canadian broad! This speaks VOLUMES in itself!

    I am not surprised. Justine “Elliott” Trudeau has half his cabinet women, only because they are women, qualifications be dammed. ie: The environment minister is a global warming cult member. Just like Barry in the USA, Canadians will see the real agenda soon.
    PS- To all you libs reading this. If Trump becomes POTUS, and you want to move from the US, do not got to Canada. You are not wanted here. Scandinavia, or N. Korea would be more suited to your way of thinking and lifestyle.

  87. Carlotta says:

    @feeriker
    Agreed and agreed.

  88. Looking Glass says:

    @Jack Russell Terrorist:

    It’s sort of amazing when non-Americans complain about our political system, especially the clucking by some of the Canadian Elites, when Trudeau is only PM because of 3 reasons: 1) His father is remember now well (when he was pretty terrible), 2) the CAD is down almost 40% in the last 3 years and 3) a long-term previous government.

    You have my sympathy, as your economy is about to implode. And I really doubt there’s any US Libs reading this forum, lol.

  89. @Trust: Get your friend over to https://www.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill and have him read the books on our sidebar. If you get him to the gym regularly at the same time, by the time he finishes them he will be raving about how his marriage has improved.

    Dread Game: It does the marriage good. That is what ASDGamer is trying to tell you. Your friend may be a “good man” but he can be a “great man” if he gets control of the situation by showing a little “bad man” (as defined by modern feminism) qualities.

    Your friend should start by ignoring her Shit Tests and Agreeing and Amplifying them occasionally (Level 1 Dread). At the same time he needs to build his Man Action Plan and build his physical body by lifting while building his psychological and emotional processes by reading and studying (Level 2 Dread). He needs to get busy so he has something to do when his wife denies him sex again (Level 3 Dread). After a few months when he is in shape again, he needs to begin conditioning the (sexual) availability of his wife to him, with his emotional, psychological, and actual availability of him to her (Level 4 Dread). Then since he no longer has the dad bod, he needs to upgrade his wardrobe (Level 5).

    If that doesn’t work over about a year, then we will just have to use stronger measures and begin studying Pick up Artistry and game and practicing on his wife (Level 6). If there is still no improvement then he can start cold approaching random women and practicing his day game on them (Level 7) and ultimately demonstrate his ability to pull younger/hotter women than his wife (Level 8). Finally, he can give a quiet, soft ultimatum (Level 9) followed by the divorce ultimatum which I like to call: “Fuck me or fuck you” (Level 10).

    Somebody should write an entire book about Dread Game! I would call it:

    >Saving a Low Sex Marriage: A Man’s Guide to Dread, Seduction, and the Long Game”

    https://bluepillprofessor.wordpress.com/2015/05/22/hello-world/

  90. Novaseeker says:

    You have my sympathy, as your economy is about to implode.

    I don’t have any particular sympathy for them. They were all clucking and giggling in 2008 while they were living high on the hog due to the China-driven commodities boom, which fueled a housing bubble in several of their major cities. He who laughs last laughs the best, in my opinion. And no better target than smug Canadians.

  91. Looking Glass says:

    @Novaseeker:

    Debt-fueled asset bubbles are truly evil things. A lot of good people get wiped out for the greed for a fairly specific set at the top. (I’m not normally one to go that way on a topic, but those types of Asset bubbles drive huge amounts of wealth, via lending, to a very small amount at the top. If it “works”, it also moves a lot of people up an economic tier in life, so they think it’s great. Until the piper has to be paid.) So those at the bottom have my sympathy.

  92. Pingback: Entryism is idolatry | Dark Brightness

  93. theasdgamer says:

    Lol @ Novaseeker

  94. theasdgamer says:

    Oh, if you like a massively cuckstian denomination, do you want one where all the hierarchy marries the Church and cuckolds Christ on a galactic scale? Oh, yeah, baby, sign me up!

  95. theasdgamer says:

    Also, lol @ Novaseeker with his elitist, UMC tone. Paul got down and dirty in his prose, like when he called all of men’s righteousness “filthy rags”, meaning “filthy menstrual rags”. Or like when Paul hoped that the judaizers would cut off their dicks (“emasculate themselves”).

    Lol @ his snootiness.

  96. feeriker says:

    One of the things that I see that you are missing about this Mary Kassian is that she is a Canadian broad! This speaks VOLUMES in itself!

    Sheila Gregoire is Canadian too. I cannot, in fact, think of a single Canadian woman of any note who self-identifies as “Christian” who isn’t also a militant feminist.

  97. Boxer says:

    feeriker:

    Most Canuckistani women are entitled feminists, and in my experience, the Jews, Sikhs and Muslims are no better than the Christian variety.

    The girls from way out in the back woods small towns are better than T-dot or Calgary hoes, but even they have a weird sense of entitlement about them. Brother Mark gives good advice when he urges all self-respecting men to steer clear of Canadian broads. If you must, just use them for sex and move on — they respond best to that sort of treatment anyway.

    Boxer

  98. Novaseeker says:

    You know, AspergerGamer, that your condition shines through very well in your posts. Dalrock has noticed it, and I have as well. It’s fine if you don’t like my own tone, but let me state it plainly: your own approach to almost every actual interlocutor everywhere you posts reeks of a social insensitivity which is obvious to everyone but yourself. I know you can’t help that, but because you are at least aware of your condition, it would be at the very least appropriate to self-monitor more effectively. I realize that even suggesting this to you will be taken badly by you, again, given your condition, but it is what it is. For the many other readers and commenters at Dalrock’s fine blog, it’s important to state it as it is so that they understand what is going on.

  99. JDG says:

    Keep up the good work Dalrock. I may not have a lot of time to comment as of late, but I still read. Most of what I would say is already being said anyhow.

  100. theasdgamer says:

    lol @ Nova’s ignorance about ASD. Aspergers ain’t the same as ASD. Shrinks don’t even diagnose Aspergers any more. Try again, schweetheart.

    Your high mindedness and objectivity are well exemplified by calling me “AspergerGamer”. Well done! lol

    You lose. Take your seat among the peanut gallery.

  101. theasdgamer says:

    You know, I actually like feministhater quite a lot, especially because of his pugnacious attitude and his good sense to recognize wisdom even in his opponents.

  102. greyghost says:

    Bluepillprofesser
    Outstanding post for Trust. All men especially Christians need to be red pill and have a full understanding of female nature and “game” The benefits are huge. First off it removes the stress from the relationship with the sexless wife. Second it frees your mind of clutter. It will free yourself to make self improvements that benefit you.
    Regularly hitting the gym is really good. The benefits besides strengthening your body are you get a chance to be in a masculine environment. And if you are consistent you will slowly get the respect of other men and a rapport with them. BTW health issues will just start to cure themselves for some reason.
    Red pill mind set will allow you to “see” and hear a whole new world from old movies to new ones, and music is even different. You will also stop giving a shit which is very cleansing for the soul. Vetting good and bad females is easy and you will see who are just pussy and the ones you can care about.
    Last and most important red pill makes the bible much more understandable and frees you to be more faithful and less stressed about being righteous. Just be a man and have faith. It also allows one to see and recognize the shit Dalrock has be posting articles about.
    Once again outstanding post professor. Asgamer is on the right track but his execution was that of an ass. I hope you Christian men here don’t let that prevent you from arming yourself for a fight in this world. .Some of you all have prayed. Well this shared conversation is God’s answer. You are of this world you must fight, live and die in this world as the men god created you to be. Faith

  103. Trust says:

    @greyghost
    @Bluepillprofesser
    _______

    Mentioning my best man’s sexless marriage (which he’s never discussed with me) was never meant to make it about him or how to help him. My original point was about how women will shame man for sex without love, but these same women don’t blink a lash at marriage without love (or sex). My best man was just an example of how women act this way, and how her rebellion is backed by the state. He is also an example of how a man’s godliness do not give women tingles, as is commonly preached. True losers commonly get women’s motors running, so i’m not interested in a woman’s vagina as the measure of a man’s virtue

    This thread was derailed because theasdgamer sat at his keyboard scanning for opportunities to beat his chest and try to convince everyone (and probably himself) he’s an alpha. I read dalrock, roosh, vox, heartiste and others most days. I”m familiar with game. Not impressed by smack talk from a man who reminds me of a neutered dachshund trying to lead the big dogs while peeing like a puppy.

  104. DrTorch says:

    Nice summary bluepillprof

  105. greyghost says:

    I don’t think you derailed anything Trust. I wouldn’t speak to your friend to get him laid speak to him for his own emotional and intellectual well being. I will also add to what you said. godliness doesn’t give the tinges. (Blue pill Godliness) Red pill Godliness now that is different. You didn’t derail a thing.

  106. theasdgamer says:

    Kudos to Trust for figuring out that I was playing dominance games. (Some of the bystanders were probably drinking near-beer and eating pretzels.) I’ve been interested in dominance tactics and frame lately and this thread was about trying them out (for me).

    Thanks for playing to all those who played. No hard feelings on my end. It was interesting to see how people responded.

    I am for truth and wisdom. My friends will be those who also love truth and wisdom. My close friends will also read scripture accurately. The rest can scroll down past my comments.

  107. Will S. says:

    “I cannot, in fact, think of a single Canadian woman of any note who self-identifies as “Christian” who isn’t also a militant feminist.”

    I can think of just one, but she doesn’t blog any more, and has in fact now married an American and moved to the States.🙂

  108. theasdgamer says:

    Oh, the “he’s a spergie loser” was a total fail as a tactic in this thread. “He’s a manipulative sonuvabitch” would have been more accurate. Dominance games fall under Machiavellian studies.

  109. ASD is an add on symptom to Celiac disease. I know that hasn’t been established yet by the medical industrial complex. But they have determined that the odds of having a child with ASD iks 1/88 before noon each day and in the afternoon (CST, YMMV in your time zone) the odds are 1/110.

    You thinkin what I’m thinkin? Yep, yep, you’ve got it……GLUTEN is the culprit so unpacking all the stats reveals that boys are more prone to ASD,. With me so far? This is absolutely true despite being wrapped in satire, that there exists a demographic of moms with young boys who have boys that have been diagnosed ASD and the moms in this cohort are orders of magnitude more prone to wear their son’s ASD on their sleeve. Perhaps quite literally as they tend to be activists and advocates and introduce themselves as “Hi I’m Mrs Nogmo and my son is ASD…..meet’cha”. Oddly this cohort has been shown to say their son is ASD well prior to a clinician confirming a preponderance of diagnostic criteria. In other words they appear to WANT to be able to claim they have a son with ASD.

    The other truth in the satire is that more than half of the number of women saying they have celiac disease have not had the three pronged testing done to confirm it. About35% have never even visited a physician to discuss it. Incidentally this cohort is white, middle to upper class, college educated and married mother of young children.

    Therefore remember elementary school math and the intersection of two sets? There you have it. Self diagnosed celiacs are prone to diagnose their own sons as ASD.

    Wait for it in JAMA. (that’s not sleepware celiac moms with ASD boys…. its a periodical)

  110. Pedat Ebediyah says:

    @theadsgamer

    “Kudos to Trust for figuring out that I was playing dominance games. (Some of the bystanders were probably drinking near-beer and eating pretzels.) I’ve been interested in dominance tactics and frame lately and this thread was about trying them out (for me).

    Thanks for playing to all those who played. No hard feelings on my end. It was interesting to see how people responded.

    I am for truth and wisdom. My friends will be those who also love truth and wisdom. My close friends will also read scripture accurately. The rest can scroll down past my comments.”

    I knew what was going on from the start, and I know I still have a lot to learn.

    ScribberG (Greg) on Rollo’s blog did the same thing to me once, and you know what I did? Ignored his ass and kept on posting and responding to the other bros as if he never mentioned my name. Did he talk shit to Pedat any more after that? Nope.

    And I like Greg. He and I have lot in common. Good bro. So…our brother “Trust” has to take his lumps just like everyone else.

    Getting defensive about the thing is a waste of energy. Admitting that the bros in our life are soiled in their blue-pill existence doesn’t mean you are being two-faced. It is what it is.

    I’ve said before that the majority of the married men in my circle are fat and happy in their supplicated state, and their wives irk the shit out of me to where I don’t even like being around them. Still love and support my bros though. Their shit is just raggedy.

    I help when I can, send links when I can, even though they think I’m crazy and reactionary. My response:  “I got 99 problems…but your ONE problem is way bigger than all of mine put together. LOL”

  111. Bill Smith says:

    I find it very humorous that several of you were getting on ASD for challenging someone. Am I at the right blog? Hassling someone is the name of the game here, at one time or another.

  112. Dale says:

    Dave:
    Your two video links at March 5, 2016 at 1:12 pm are fantastic. Thank you for sharing.

  113. Red Pill Latecomer says:

    greyghost: Regularly hitting the gym is really good. The benefits besides strengthening your body are you get a chance to be in a masculine environment.

    Are gyms a masculine environment?

    Here in Los Angeles, all gyms are coed. Some coed gyms do offer female-only “safe spaces.” But no male-only spaces. You even have some gyms that are exclusively female (e.g., Curves).

    Gyms also have a reputation of being pickup places. Like bars. People join to check out each other’s bodies, then hit on each other. Yoga classes are also known to be pickup places. Male yoga teachers have a reputation for being PUAs.

    Maybe that’s just Los Angeles. But are there any normal, masculine (but non-gay) gyms left in this country anymore?

  114. mrteebs says:

    @Novaseeker

    Thanks. I always wondered if there was something biological fueling asd’s unswerving tendency to be an asshole whenever given the opportunity. Now I understand.

    His dismissal of Asperger’s did – in Shakespeare’s words – “protest too much, methinks.”

    I wrote him off as a poseur a long time ago. Most of his posts are variations on the “you all need to be more like me” theme. The incriminating evidence that he’s not the AMOG he’d have us all believe is that he endured 5 years of marriage without sex.

    No true alpha…

    @asd

    The comments thread following @Trust’s posting has been a Petri dish of sorts, but not the one you imagined it to be. You seem to think you were the one observing, not realizing you were the one being observed. The “I’m-just-trying-out-my-dominance-persona” line was lame, but its lameness would escape you because that’s the crux of your problem. What you thought was an uncharacteristic excursion into assholery was actually just another in the long pedigree of postings from you that I’ve read over the last 18 months. You are far more predictable and lame than you imagine. I’m glad you managed to rescue your marriage from the brink, but you might want to rethink your strategy if your goal is to help other men, which is why I thought we were all here. Your advice is essentially to tell Trust that he should jettison his friend rather than help him. Your wrong. Your smugness is misplaced and being called out on it is long overdue.

  115. Mark says:

    @Jack Russell

    “”I am not surprised. Justine “Elliott” Trudeau has half his cabinet women, only because they are women, qualifications be dammed””…………

    Correct!….no one that I support or voted for.We are going to have some major problems with this guy.The fastest animal on the planet…..”Flight Capital” …..is rearing it’s head!

    “”If Trump becomes POTUS, and you want to move from the US, do not got to Canada. You are not wanted here.””

    I am hoping that Trump gets the Nod.I am phoning every American that I know to get them to vote for him.I have never understood the “Canadian Mentality” towards the Americans about moving here. Personally,I would prefer it compared to all these third world people.Fortunately,for me I spend a lot of time in the US and prefer many things American versus Canadian.The US is a MUCH better country to do business in than Canada.

    @Looking Glass

    “”You have my sympathy, as your economy is about to implode.””

    Yes it is! We are sitting on the largest Real Estate bubble in the world. Commodity prices have collapsed.Trudeau has sold off our National Gold Reserves.Welfare and disability are at unbelievable highs.No country in the history of the world had prospered by paying it’s citizens not to work.When the gov’t cannot make the Welfare payments it is going to be a VERY sad day!

    @Novaseeker

    “”He who laughs last laughs the best, in my opinion. And no better target than smug Canadians.””

    Agreed!

    @feeriker

    “”I cannot, in fact, think of a single Canadian woman of any note who self-identifies as “Christian” who isn’t also a militant feminist.””

    Me neither!

    @Boxer

    “”Brother Mark gives good advice when he urges all self-respecting men to steer clear of Canadian broads.””

    That I do! You have spent enough time up here to realize that for yourself.Canadian wimminz are at the bottom of the barrel.

  116. greyghost says:

    Red pill Latecomer
    Most gyms are coed or female only. I use a commercial gym (24hour fitness) and 90% plus are male in the weight room. But I’m in Texas. kalifornia is its own world. My experience is the men here work out and get out. (that is what I do) In the eighties as a Marine out in Southern Kalifornia I notice the women even then were just attention whores in the tights going thru the motions. The only saving grace was they didn’t have cell phones back then. Just go in and take care of business. Enjoy the decline

  117. Jack Russell Terrorist says:

    Well said Mark:
    I have no issues with Americans moving to Canada.(Just ones with far left ideals) I live a short drive from the border and even with the exchange rate, I still purchase many items and have them shipped to my US address as the price is still more affordable and the faster shipping.
    Canadian women: Enough said.

  118. theasdgamer says:

    @ Bill Smith

    I find it very humorous that several of you were getting on ASD for challenging someone. Am I at the right blog? Hassling someone is the name of the game here, at one time or another.

    Lol, you’re on the right blog. Dalrock has lots of pussified Blue Pillers posting here who feel threatened by me. [shakin’ mah haid]

    To my haters:
    Hold tight to that drowning friend. I’m sure you’ll be able to rescue him. Sorry, I can’t understand you when you’re talking to me underwater. You don’t seem to be moving now. Is everything all right?

    One of the lessons in lifeguarding is to not let someone who is drowning grab a hold of you. You have to let them stop moving first, then you can rescue them. Maybe after a man goes through a frivorce he can be helped. After he has “drowned”. Til then, keep contact minimal.

  119. feeriker says:

    The US is a MUCH better country to do business in than Canada.

    If that’s the case, may God shower all of His mercy upon Canada. It has gotten so bad here in most states within the lower 48 with regulation and taxation that most new businesses are essentially underground operations. If things are really worse in Canada, stand by for the collapse; of course it’s gonna kick krav-kick us in the nuts too, and very soon.

    I have some Canadian tourists from Alberta arriving this week to spend three weeks in my rental property. They actually asked me prior to signing my rental agreement if I could give them some sort of deal to offset the pounding the Canadian dollar is taking at the moment (I reduced the amount of damage deposit I usually require, which seemed to work for them). I was happy to oblige, since my Canadian guests have, without exception, all been awesome tenants (even the women, who are mostly older retiree types). What I can’t understand is how the U.S. dollar right now is so heavily trouncing the Canadian, even with the Fed’s usual manipulations.

  120. theasdgamer says:

    @ Pedat

    I knew what was going on from the start, and I know I still have a lot to learn.

    We all have a lot to learn.

  121. theasdgamer says:

    @ Pedat

    I’ve said before that the majority of the married men in my circle are fat and happy in their supplicated state, and their wives irk the shit out of me to where I don’t even like being around them.

    Fat and dumb, maybe. Happy? Well, if getting sex twice a month makes a man happy, then they’re happy, I guess. If women are giving men shit, then they aren’t getting the sex they want with the men they want.

  122. theasdgamer says:

    @ RICanuck


    You violated Rollo Tomassi’s Iron Rule #1 – Frame.

    You walked into asdgamer’s frame, and left your own. He should have been ignored or gamed. You are trying to live red pill, so you know you have to game the women in your life, and if you choose to respond, game asdgamer. He was looking for a BSD contest, and you should not have given him one.

    Good analysis.

  123. Kudos to Trust for figuring out that I was playing dominance games. (Some of the bystanders were probably drinking near-beer and eating pretzels.) I’ve been interested in dominance tactics and frame lately and this thread was about trying them out (for me).

    Nice excuse for acting like a cunt. Ain’t going to fly with me. You acted like a douche, not like a man. Get over your games, they don’t help anyone, least of all yourself. You come off as a Mark Driscoll wannabe, a lame stunt you pulled.

    If you want to play your silly mind fuck games, perhaps you shouldn’t do them here, that’s called trolling by any other name.

  124. Novaseeker says:

    What I can’t understand is how the U.S. dollar right now is so heavily trouncing the Canadian, even with the Fed’s usual manipulations.

    Commodities. When you have a one-sided economy, like Canada does, your currency lives and dies on the price of one segment of the market. It was a great trade to short the loonie beginning around the middle of 2015 and continuing, really, until a couple of months ago, and plenty of folks made significant money doing just that. If you’re trading the loonie or the aussie, you basically need to be a good analyst of the commodities markets.

  125. Trust says:

    @Bill Smith

    I enjoy being challenged. That’s why I read manosphere and I agree with a lot.

    theasegamma didn’t challenge anything. He swooped in like Tarzan, beating his chest, saying “you beta, me alpha” “you blue pill, me red pill” “he loser, me winner.”. Not much of a challenge. Happy to discuss issues, but what he missed in his barking was that I am not here disagreeing about game or complementarianism. I was simply observing related idiosyncrasies of the feminine psyche.

    He doesnt want to discuss. He is begging someone to validate his alpha fantasies.

  126. m11nine says:

    Dude (Trust),

    You threw out a case study/field report of a friend going 3 years w/o marital relations. What did you expect to happen?

    Your buddy absolutely needs a wake up call and strong language, but since you are hearing it only via his shitty wife, I don’t know what can be done except discuss it in places like this so others can learn from it.

    Amog or not, ASD was on point with: “Your “best man” may be a good man, but he also needs to be good at being a man. Putting up with a sexless marriage for three years shows that he isn’t good at being a man. Been there, done that, I worked on self-improvement and no more sexless marriage.”

  127. OKRickety says:

    theasdgamer said on March 6, 2016 at 3:56 pm

    lol @ Nova’s ignorance about ASD. Aspergers ain’t the same as ASD. Shrinks don’t even diagnose Aspergers any more. Try again, schweetheart.

    While I am not an expert on ASD and Aspergers, I am going to clarify your statement “Aspergers ain’t the same as ASD”.

    I have a 20-year-old son diagnosed with Aspergers four years ago, so I have a vested interest in the subject. He denies that he has it, and is fond of pointing out that they don’t diagnose Aspergers now. This is true, as Aspergers was removed as a separate classification (first widely recognized in 1981?) in DSM-5 in 2013 (and ICD-11 is likely to do the same).

    However, the symptoms that would previously have received a diagnosis of Aspergers will now receive a diagnosis of ASD. So, “Aspergers ain’t the same as ASD”, but now Aspergers is included in ASD.

  128. Gunner Q says:

    Jack Russell Terrorist @ March 6, 2016 at 9:29 am:
    “PS- To all you libs reading this. If Trump becomes POTUS, and you want to move from the US, do not got to Canada. You are not wanted here.”

    Liberals still do that? I thought it was just a Vietnam draft thing. They run this country, why would they leave? Oh.

    Red Pill Latecomer @ 12:43 am:
    “Maybe that’s just Los Angeles. But are there any normal, masculine (but non-gay) gyms left in this country anymore?”

    Northern California gyms are no better.

  129. PokeSalad says:

    I enjoy being challenged.

    Apparently your friend doesn’t.

  130. Mike T says:

    theasdgamer,

    You think you are Red Pill, but actually you are not. Your friend puts up with a sexless marriage for three years? lol, that’s absurd. And he’s one of the best men you know??? Seriously??? That’s so sad. You need to get in some different social circles ASAP.

    There are only so many options a Christian man has to respond to such a woman. If he abandons her over a sexless marriage, he risks damnation because refusing sex is not a valid reason for a man to leave a marriage by itself. Remarriage under such circumstances is usually adultery. If you call yourself a Christian and disagree with that statement, then take it up with Jesus because He spoke the words about marrying a divorced woman that I am referencing.

    People are often just rotten. Paul exhorts women to be godly so as to win over a husband with her conversation if he doesn’t believe. If she fails to convert him by excellence and female virtue, is that her fault? Of course not. Many people choose to respond to good with evil.

    Even if Trust’s friend is the alphiest alpha on the block it doesn’t mean that his particular wife will respond to that. She could be just a selfish nasty piece of work who literally sees men as nothing more than waking wallets that sometimes double as fleshy sex toys when she’s in the mood for all you and I know. Even if 95% of the HBD9s in the man’s life are ready to bear his children after 30 minutes of conversation, it simply does not logically follow that this must mean that his particular wife will be compelled to follow suit.

  131. Looking Glass says:

    @feeriker & Novaseeker:

    The USD is the least-weak of the major currencies. Since we’re the main Reserve Currency, so much has to be proceeded through it that quite a lot will always just end up staying in USD. This is almost wholly down to what’s been happening with China. Bubbles are nasty things, are they dislocate nearly the entire economy in the process.

  132. theasdgamer says:

    @ Mike T

    Interesting comment. There are many options other than divorce. Women tend to respond to Game, if the SoS has any relevance to reality. Otoh, not many men can accept the tenets of Game because to do so would create cognitive dissonance with their Blue Pill programming (especially an epistemic crisis). Preselection and Dread Game are in the SoS, but men twist scripture so that they avoid seeing Game in the SoS. If the wife saw the HB9s flirting with her husband, chances are that her Hamster would recalculate her husband’s SMV.

  133. theasdgamer says:

    @ OkRickety

    He denies that he has it, and is fond of pointing out that they don’t diagnose Aspergers now.

    Nevertheless, he clearly has ASD, which he needs to compensate for. Has he gotten any obsessions that would lead him to learn social lessons?

  134. Mike T says:

    theasdgamer,

    All game can do is increase his odds. It does not give him a magic ability to make a frigid bitch not frigid. You left out in that original attack (didn’t read much follow ups; came in late) the possibility that she really doesn’t give a damn about marriage. A lot of people actually don’t today. Even if he became “hawt” it’s possible that she will view it as “I got him, I can get a new one with less baggage.”

    Dread game cannot work in a Christian marriage if the wife is savvy to her husband’s commitment to Christian marriage. She will consciously know that he is not going to act on her jealousy and bang that HBD9 in the bathroom even if the girl is 110% DTF. So at that point, it comes back to who she is. Is she a good woman who lost her attraction or a selfish bitch? If the former, there’s hope. If the latter, no. If that happens, he can only pray to God that she repents. If their marriage was valid, he risks Hell fire by going and getting his elsewhere even if she acts like she’s now a slutty reincarnation of Elizabeth Bathory.

    Dude, fact is unless I missed something, we don’t know what this guy is like. You could be shocked to find that he’s what Vox Day calls a “higher beta” which in Roissy/Roosh terms is a guy who is 75% alpha. If the guy was some gamma or omega, I think Trust would probably not even bring it up because the question would answer itself.

  135. Mike T says:

    Bad phrasing there. Dread game can work if the wife is a good woman who needs to see proof that her husband isn’t the loser that for some reason she now thinks he is. It cannot work outside of that, unless he is willing to risk damnation for sex.

  136. m11nine says:

    I’m no longer in the fold, but have to think the dread still works in a christian environment, its not like that is an affair-free zone for either sex. The horrible example wife in the example has to know of broken families in her church and community. There is always risk.

    If he does dread without a word, she can never be that savvy. The risk is real.

    By the way, I don’t know that any of us can definitively answer that question of “what you would do?”.

  137. Mike T says:

    Dread can work in the here and now, but presumably as a Christian he is cognizant of the fact that effective means of achieving temporal goals can result in unacceptable eternal consequences. It’s not impossible to use some dread in a Christian marriage, but we should not kid ourselves that what is possible without risking our souls is weak sauce compared to what guys like Roissy mean when they speak of Dread Game.

    Yes, if you are more concerned about getting laid than getting into heaven, you have many options available to you. It’s not really a wise choice to choose sexual gratification over salvation. In the long run, the Christian man who refuses to be disobedient to how God wants him to treat a wayward wife will be rewarded. Sadly enough for her, she will not only face His justice but she may be rewarded with damnation for her treatment of a good man.

  138. theasdgamer says:

    @ Mike T

    All game can do is increase his odds.

    No, Game increases a man’s sexual desirability. There are no odds involved. Dread is a powerful motivating force in a woman’s mind.

    Dread game cannot work in a Christian marriage if the wife is savvy to her husband’s commitment to Christian marriage.

    One can never be savvy to anyone else’s commitment, no matter their words. If a man goes out clubbing both weekend nights, Dread will be a powerful motivating factor. If a man stays out all night–maybe in a motel room–and is incommunicado, that will increase Dread. Going to the gym and losing weight, taking group dance lessons, taking a class in extemp speech, buying a motorcycle, etc. will increase Dread. Flirting with women will create the Dread mindset and the associated nonverbals that a man gets from flirting with women will communicate to the wife that other women find her husband desirable.

    Refusing a spouse sex is a worse sin than adultery. Marriage is primarily a commitment to have sex. Sex is a physical marriage of a man and a woman. Children are a hoped-for fruit, but there can be marriage without children.

    I view the promise of exclusivity as secondary to and contingent upon the promise to have sex. Refusing sex is the equivalent of adultery or worse. Refusing sex, if it’s the equivalent of adultery/sexual immorality, then it’s grounds for divorce. Will any man argue that refusing sex to a spouse is not sexually immoral, assuming that health isn’t an issue?

    A man needs the ZFG mindset when flirting with his wife. ZFG produces Dread.

  139. theasdgamer says:

    @ Trust

    Only give help if help is asked for. Don’t presume to offer help unasked. Of course, breadcrumbs are a wise approach in your friend’s case.

    If the wife is denying sex, likely he’s being cuckolded. Use breadcrumbs -> Dread of cuckolding

  140. Boxer says:

    Maybe that’s just Los Angeles. But are there any normal, masculine (but non-gay) gyms left in this country anymore?

    Jack Donovan (author of The Way of Men) is trying to get this movement started, with some success. Note that Jack is openly gay, but most of the members of his gym are not. He occasionally posts about this on his blog.

    The problem with such gyms is that they are forced to be somewhat underground to evade troublemaking feminists looking for lawsuits; so, while there are pictures of these gyms floating around, there aren’t any addresses. If I could find the one in the town I’m in now, I’d join it.

    In short, the answer to your question is yes, but if you’re actually asking a serious question about where to find one, then the answer is probably no (at least from me).

  141. Mark says:

    @Novaseeker

    “”It was a great trade to short the loonie beginning around the middle of 2015 and continuing, really, until a couple of months ago, and plenty of folks made significant money doing just that.””

    ^^^^^^^^This!…..We made a ton of money shorting the loonie.As well as commodity contracts,such as oil.

    @Red Pill Latecomer

    “”But are there any normal, masculine (but non-gay) gyms left in this country anymore?””

    I hear ya brother.Remember that there is a difference between a “real gym” and a “fitness club”.The gym that I go to is just that…..a REAL GYM! It is on the seedier side of town and is owned and run by the Hell’s Angels.The number of machines you can count on one hand.The good ones.Leg press,hack squat etc.Everything is “free weights”.The only woman in the gym is the chick behind the desk.I want to assure you that this is not my crowd that I run with but,their gym suits my purpose.Every guy in there has a tattoo and a Harley.I have neither.I am the only guy that shows up in a suit.They all like me and when they are there,like myself,they train their asses off.I respect that!

    @greyghost

    I got this from a buddy of mine that I introduced to the Manosphere about 3 years ago.I also showed it to The Family Office Money Managers.My reasoning is that they laughed at me when I referred to this industry for future investment.They are not laughing now.Seems the Fem-Tards are getting their panties in a wad….L*

    http://www.campaignagainstsexrobots.com/

  142. m11nine says:

    Mike T,

    I think you misunderstand the potential of dread if you don’t bring people like bluepillprofessor and marriedredpill into the conversation. There are pro-faithfulness/pro-marriage flavors that would suit you better than roissy.

    The concept of giving up and moving on to a better partner are final steps in BPP’s list.
    https://www.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/2lpafb/the_12_step_plan_of_dread_book_excerpt_from_my/

  143. m11nine says:

    And those final steps are after a long process of turnaround that are said to be rarely necessary.

  144. Pingback: She holds an authority you cannot hold. | Dalrock

  145. Mike T says:

    The concept of giving up and moving on to a better partner are final steps in BPP’s list.

    Actually, I think you misunderstand the theological aspect here. What you posted is not possible for many or most Christians to do safely. Read Luke 16:18, among others. A man can leave his wife if she decides to make the marriage unbearable (truly unbearable). However, he is not free to just leave her and remarry a better spouse because God does not recognize the divorce.

  146. Mike T says:

    theasdgamer,

    No, Game increases a man’s sexual desirability. There are no odds involved. Dread is a powerful motivating force in a woman’s mind.

    There are odds involved. Even a perfect specimen of masculinity can find some women who aren’t lesbians and who won’t put out for him. What increased sexual desirability does is increase his odds of getting the sex and relationship he wants. It cannot go to 100% realization because there are women who will never be attracted to him for some reason.

    One can never be savvy to anyone else’s commitment, no matter their words. If a man goes out clubbing both weekend nights, Dread will be a powerful motivating factor. If a man stays out all night–maybe in a motel room–and is incommunicado, that will increase Dread. Going to the gym and losing weight, taking group dance lessons, taking a class in extemp speech, buying a motorcycle, etc. will increase Dread. Flirting with women will create the Dread mindset and the associated nonverbals that a man gets from flirting with women will communicate to the wife that other women find her husband desirable.

    And if the man creates an appearance of evil and scandalizes his children, then he has done evil in the sight of God. It is also possible for him to scandalize his wife. It also possible for him to do that with other women if he entices them to be receptive to the advances of a married man.

    Some of the things you said do not pose a risk of scandal. The classes, the motorcycle, the weight loss, all good stuff. Creating a perception that he might be getting some on the side or flirting with the idea is evil on its face. If you are a Christian, you cannot advise a brother to go there. The best you can do is to tell him to not necessarily discourage women from flirting with him.

  147. Pingback: Ye shall know them by their cartoonish chivalry. | Dalrock

  148. Chip Pacer says:

    WOW ! When reading … Yes, there is that well-worn verse in 1 Timothy, but it seems a shame to let one occurrence of a term dominate our language and practice. It may be that permission vocabulary persists because of the unfortunate woman-as-usurper stereotype that sometimes underlies complementarian thought. … I did not know if I should get mad, or cry (a ‘manly cry’ that is (smile))

    First the use of the term ‘well worn’ implies that the verse is no longer able to satisfactorily meet its intended use. Like a ‘well worn sweater’ that while might be comfortable, can no longer provide warmth. Or the ‘well worn sneakers’ that while are not totally useless – cannot provide the necessary support or traction.

    Why stop with this verse in 1 Timothy ? Why not cast aside or re-interpret that now well worn verse … ‘for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son … and whoever believes …’, or Romans 3:23 … ‘for all have sinned and …’ ???

    Jeez … and without going too far down another rabbit hole, Wilkin has another blog entry that talks about the dads who are believers and who have spiritually abandoned the family and have left the teaching up to the women. She makes a case for why it is right that women have taken the helm on this one.

    But I have asked before and I’ll ask again – what about the application of Ruth 1:16 ? But Ruth replied, “Don’t urge me to leave you or to turn back from you. Where you go I will go, and where you stay I will stay. Your people will be my people and your God my God

    Where is that teaching by these women ?

    Ahhhh !! I forgot … that verse too is too well worn. Thank-you for the reminder

  149. Alana Childers says:

    Wow, you complementarians are really scary people. I grew up in your mindset, always taught that women are like segregated blacks – separate but “equal” – (which means less equal). I have rarely seen an egalitarian marriage fall apart, but I have lost count of all the complementarian ones that have! You people should read, “Boundaries in Marrige” by Dr. Henry Cloud. especially the guy calling himself, “PM”, who says:
    March 4, 2016 at 10:02 pm
    My wife is being “pursued” for a women’s ministry. She says that she is a submissive wife because she tells me what she wants and then does whatever I decide. That much is true, but if I decide on other than what she wants she feels sad or disappointed and then tries to “win me over without a word”. This means avoiding me and spending more time with friends and family and not talking to me much when we are together. When I ask her why she isn’t talking much she says it is to avoid the temptation of arguing with me. She won’t turn me down for sex, but instead tells me she is not in the mood but will do it if I want to. Not giving her what she wants means loneliness, less affection and starfish sex.
    Technically she is obedient but this isn’t something that she needs to be teaching other women. I am not against women teaching women in general. However I believe that the woman’s husband should be the one overseeing her teaching. A woman who isn’t pleasing to her own husband shouldn’t be teaching others.

    Wow, what an egotistical monster YOU must be! Let’s guess how many years it will take before your wife leaves your controlling, miserable butt. If you really loved your wife, how could you treat her like this? 1) you expect her to do whatever you decide. Ever heard, absolute power corrupts absolutely? That’s you, dictator PM. 2.) When you override her wants, she is sad. Well, no wonder, she is married to a dictator that treats her like a servant. 3.) you complain about sex. Um, this should be obvious. If you don’t love her enough to treat her as an equal, no surprise she is loathe to jump your misogynistic bones. 4.) You don’t even respect her enough for her to minister to other women without your *laugh* overseeing her. What a treat you are. 5.) You obviously think it’s her main mission in life to please you. Well, then, you should have moved to the middle east so you can just buy your own woman slave. Then you could beat the crap out of her if she doesn’t please you.
    How can you not see your own arrogance? Yet you people make fun of egalitarians. How did Jesus treat women? Even Mary, he encouraged to learn at his feet equally with the disciples, and even chastized Martha for trying to force Mary back into the traditional “women’s” role. The woman at the well, Jesus gave the task of evangelizing her whole village! And when he rose from the grave, He honored women with the joy of being the first to proclaim that He lives. Yet you people, you complementarians treat women as segregated citizens, existing only for the pleasure of their masters/husbands. How does this exalt Jesus Christ?

  150. Pingback: Don’t tell women no. | Dalrock

  151. Pingback: Where have all the good chimps gone? | Dalrock

  152. Pingback: Who is she teaching? | Dalrock

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s