Way ahead of you

Commenters pacguy and Jonadab-the-Rechabite both point out that by the definitions of abuse from Life Skills International and FotF wives are regularly abusing their husbands, and they are very often doing so at the direction of Life Skills, FotF, the Davissons, and Drs. Hegstrom, Clarke, and Harley.   Each of the following is defined as abuse on the Life Skills Power and Control wheel:

  • Affection is conditional (denying sex would certainly count here)
  • Threatens to end the relationship
  • Threatens to take the children.
  • Uses partner’s money and/or credit with or without their knowledge.
  • Accuses.
  • Manipulates.
  • Commits mental blackmail.

This is a very short sample, but it gives an idea of the problem feminists have here.  Feminists are using accusations of abuse to bully and abuse good men.  There is no way around this.  It works because good men want to help and protect women.  It is as I mentioned, sheer evil brilliance.

Moreover, they know exactly what they are doing, which is why they created a special definition of abuse called knowledge abuse.  If you point out that by their definition of abuse that you are in fact the one being abused, this is proof that you are an abuser.

Receives a limited amount of counseling and uses it against partner;  uses knowledge of partner’s past against them…

Reads and listens to self-help books and tapes then uses the information to blame the partner for problems in the relationship.

So when your wife listens to FotF and learns that you are the source of the relationship’s problems and threatens to leave you, take your children away from you, and/or denies sex unless you do what she wants, you can’t defend yourself by pointing out that these are all abuse.  As the man you are the abuser, period, and arguing otherwise is just more proof that you are an abuser.

Even worse, if your wife is diagnosed as Borderline, Bipolar, etc. and you point out that she is abusing you in ways that fit with this diagnosis, this is also knowledge abuse:

uses medical professional’s comments or advice to blame partner for the problems in the relationship

These folks know exactly what they are doing, and they have spent decades perfecting their methodology to do so.  Don’t fall for the same mistake so many other men have made of assuming they are actually acting in (perhaps misguided) good faith, or that this is actually about abuse.  It is not, it is about destroying headship by taking power away from husbands and giving it to their wives.  They come right out and tell us this by explaining that you can’t use their own definitions against them, just like the Duluth Model website tells us this more directly (emphasis mine):

Making the Power and Control Wheel gender neutral would hide the power imbalances in relationships between men and women that reflect power imbalances in society. By naming the power differences, we can more clearly provide advocacy and support for victims, accountability and opportunities for change for offenders, and system and societal changes that end violence against women.

As they state plainly, the goal of the Duluth Model is to:

…change societal conditions that support men’s use of tactics of power and control over women.

This isn’t about methods or tactics of using power, which is why they are fine when women use the same methods against men.  This is about the power dynamic itself.  This isn’t about how power is used, but about who has the power.

Related:  The crazy dictator.

This entry was posted in Attacking headship, Domestic Violence, Dr. David Clarke, Dr. Paul Hegstrom, Dr. Willard Harley, Duluth Model, Focus on the Family, Joel and Kathy Davisson, Threatpoint, Wake-up call, You can't make this stuff up. Bookmark the permalink.

96 Responses to Way ahead of you

  1. Looking Glass says:

    The old saying “The only good Marxist is a dead Marxist” generally applies here. These people are relentlessly evil.

  2. “I myself see in this war, if the North triumph, a dissolution of the bonds of all society. It is not alone the destruction of our property (which both the nation and the States are bound to protect), but it is the prelude to anarchy, infidelity, and the ultimate loss of free responsible government on this continent. With these convictions, I always thought we ought to meet the Federal invaders on the outer verge of just right and defence, and raise at once the black flag, viz., “No quarter to the violators of our homes and firesides!” It would in the end have proved true humanity and mercy. The Bible is full of such wars, and it is the only policy that would bring the North to its senses.” Thomas “Stonewall” Jackson.

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  4. Minesweeper says:

    Well done Dalrock. This is very good. Coming from being ‘marred’ by a BPD ‘christian’ x-wife, I can fully concur the sentiments displayed above are fully endorsed by many in the churches, unfortunately.

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  6. Pedat Ebediyah says:

    Excellent stuff, Dalrock!

    Knowledge abuse, eh…?

    Those who call bad good, and good bad, can go eat a huge wicker basket full of penises.

  7. ACThinker says:

    At the root of it, almost all arguments in a marriage are about power. Who is in control, and more importantly, Who has to change (more). If Spouse is right, then I must change. If I’m right spouse must. I’d suggest in reality both must, and conform themselves to the real model ™. That said, our modern culture doesn’t help telling us all that it is ‘the other person’s fault” When we individually take control of what we actually can (ourselves) then we cease being the victim and start having better days.

  8. Art Deco says:

    One recalls Helen Smith’s formulation of a certain contemporary mentality: “women have options. men have obligations.”.

  9. Exfernal says:

    What happened to “Ignorance is not a virtue”?

  10. johnmcg says:

    On the one hand, some double standards make sense. I get why black people can use the n-word and white people can’t. There is a legacy of baggage there.

    And I could see where husband’s superior physical and economic behavior, particularly in times past, could mean that the exact same behavior from men could be abusive when from women it is not. When one party is capable of inflicting serious physical harm on the other, or leaving them economically destitute, and the other is not, that does carry with it additional responsibilities.

    But that is not the situation we are in right now, in particular not in the marriages where wives are free to listen to this advice and husbands are remotely open to it.

    As has been well-documented here, the world we live in now is one where a wife can remove a husband from the home, cut off his access to children, and take a healthy percentage of his future income.

    Indeed, it seems it may be time for the double standard be weighted the other way.

  11. Damn Crackers says:

    How does Christian marriage exist in this world? Unless you plan on shutting your bride in a closet for the entirety of her life, I don’t see how a modern woman wouldn’t be brainwashed through all the institutions with this shit.

  12. Dash Riprock says:

    Very good series indeed Dalrock. I give no source greater “credit” in turning me from a regular, red blooded American man to a blue pill Churchian wuss than Focus on Family, Dobson included. Yes, “turn your heart toward home” oh man and focus on your family (which is FofF for Wife) and not on the world of Men.. That is not your place. Have no passion or interests beyond that of a dumb ox hooked to the millstone, otherwise you are selfish like a “typical” man. Which was to be avoided at all costs. Be content to be a “servant-leader”, emphasis on the first, fade the second. Seriously, years of listening to that drivel drip by mellow drip, disguised as “traditional, family, values” nearly cost me my sanity and my family. Now a few years down the red pill road I can say the healthy place that I find both myself and my marriage in is not merely the result of the deprogramming (to which you Dalrock played a part) of what I learned over the airwaves from the vipers of Colorado (among others) but by today frankly acting directly contrary to their teaching. Once I stopped treating my wife like a “beautiful rose that I was privileged to garden” and treated her instead like a woman again things started falling into place rather quickly. A Christian man would be wise to pay attention to what these turncoats teach (so he knows what he is up against from those in “ministry”) and then do the polar opposite. You show once gain what a dangerous environment Christian “culture” is today for the average Christian man.

  13. feeriker says:

    One of the goals of not only the Christian Manosphere, but Christians of both sexes regardless of their philosophical inclinations who recognize and believe in immutable biblical truth, should be to mercilessly pursue those of these frauds who dare call themselves Christian when their message is clearly unbiblical (Finishing off the Family, the Davissons, et al.). Whenever these people make an appearance in public or open their mouths via electronic media to vomit forth their vile, destructive, satanic feminist heresy, someone –multiple people, preferably, need to immediately and mercilessly launch a counterattack, the goal being to corner or shame them into renouncing any biblical justifications for their foulness and tl make them admit that they are secular humanists attempting to co-opt Christian marriage for their own selfish gains, and for God-only-knows-what true motivation.

    Sure, dedicating oneself to the above mission will probably at some point lead to one being accused of harrassment or stalking, but the truth shall not be suppressed. I also like to imagine Jesus Himself repeating His reaction to the temple moneychangers with those who seek to destroy the godly family.

  14. Chris says:

    “What happened to “Ignorance is not a virtue”?”

    It morphed into “Ignorance is bliss.”

  15. feeriker says:

    Those who call bad good, and good bad, can go eat a huge wicker basket full of penises.

    I think telling them to go straight to their assigned places in hell is more appropriate in this case.

  16. peregrinejohn says:

    Ok, so what should be done in this (very common) case?

  17. Magnus says:

    I wonder what Dr. Hegstrom and the Davissons would say to a genuinely abused man: A man who has been denied sex for years, has been emotionally manipulated and threatened with divorce and financial ruin, and has had his children taken away to be raised by the mother and a replacement father on the other side of the country. Would they care? Would they have even an ounce of sympathy? Are are they so blinded with ideology that they are incapable of empathy and reason?

    You are right, Dalrock. They know what they are doing.

  18. The Question says:

    As bad as these people are, and as evil as their beliefs are, I consider the ideas themselves laughable and impotent. These people’s ideas are dangerous only because they can use the power of the state to force them on society. It is not Life Skills, FotF, the Davissons, or any of these others who arrive at men’s door with guns and drag them out of their own homes, under the penalty of death for resisting, because the wives falsely accused them of abuse. It is not these people who issue court orders that rip children out of their father’s arms, restrict a father’s access to their own children, and steal the men’s property, wealth, life savings, and livelihood via imputed income to finance the wife’s post-frivorce lifestyle. It is not these people who throw men in jail for being unable to pay child support or alimony, even when the child isn’t theirs.

    All of this is done by the state.

    These people can call good husbands and fathers “abusive” all they want for the most pitiful of reasons and contradict themselves until Judgment Day, but ultimately their ideas require armed men willing to kill those who resist, along with a populace that believes they have the legitimate authority to do so.

  19. John says:

    My wife is abusive by this list. If she approves of my behavior then she is enthusiastic in bed, flirty and affectionate. If not then she is polite but not warm. She claims that it is not manipulation but that she behaves differently when she’s happy. I can choose between doing what I want and having a wife who is civil and nothing more and doing what she wants and getting a happy wife. Sounds like manipulation to me.

  20. greyghost says:

    The MGTOW bunch and the guys that do the murder suicide thing seem to have been a few years ahead of us here. I hope this article explains why the church failing. Everything discussed in the article is fully enforced by law with real guns and bullets. Women wouldn’t have it any other way including our beloved Christian women.

    I think telling them to go straight to their assigned places in hell is more appropriate in this case

    I’m sure they are all going to hell including the bubble heads following this life path of feminine empowerment. I wouldn’t waste to much time saving them the real change for the good of all is to educate all men to recognize this and what to do about it (indifference, MGTOW, PUA for the nonbelievers and for the bad asses going to theological colleges and taking the narrative for Christ and kicking asses) It is so hopeless many men have spoken of a hoped for collapse and a civil war (that may be what it takes for the elites are fully willing to kill us for compliance to this madness)
    I will not be advising my son to marry or shack up with a woman. If he truly wishes to be fruitful and multiply he will be using surrogacy or an artificial womb fully supported by his father. Stay single my friends.

  21. The Question says:

    @ greyghost

    “Everything discussed in the article is fully enforced by law with real guns and bullets.”

    Exactly. The state is the source of all their power. They are fully dependent on it.

    A lot of people don’t realize the ramifications of this. It means that you can make the wisest choice for a wife possible. It still doesn’t end the threat, because the real threat is the state. This means that at some point the state may begin enforcing a state-approved martial relationship model, even against the wishes of the wife. It means they may take it upon themselves to arrest men for “abuse” when the wife doesn’t even think it is abuse, because feminists in power say it is.

    And is it outlandish to think that at some point the state may use the threat of “revoking” someone’s marriage license to get to them comply?

    “It is so hopeless many men have spoken of a hoped for collapse and a civil war.”

    Another reason why we “doom and gloom.”
    http://anarchistnotebook.com/2015/04/23/why-we-doom-and-gloom/

    “The show may go on for now, but not forever. Some would prefer it come to a halt all at once, in a grand, spectacular fashion, rather than slowly over a painfully prolonged period of time in small intervals that are hardly noticeable until examined decades later when they are placed in the proper context.”

  22. Solomon says:

    @The Question-

    The state does it, but these folks like FOTF are the propoganda machine, to subvert hearts and minds, to get the votes they need to enact the misandric laws, then enforce them. The deceit has to start somewhere, and these wolves in sheep’s clothing are the ones to deliver.

    Intentionally.

  23. Sure, dedicating oneself to the above mission will probably at some point lead to one being accused of harrassment or stalking, but the truth shall not be suppressed

    Yes. Though not accused of harassment Ive stayed too long up against certain of these groups and been meted the consequences. Bans, revoked invitations for engagement, offered faux pity for my misguided efforts, so forth. Joel Davisson used to pop up and defend his and Kathy’s programs, and they had an army of minions for deployment when they found themselves too thin on the ground.

  24. All to hear the sound that polyester and lace makes when it is softly dragged across back seat pleather during The Lift.

  25. Ras al Ghul says:

    It is not just about power. Its about letting women abuse men freely.

    A good portion of feminists have personality disorders (which is why they expressly say using bipolar and personality disorders against women is a no go).

    Get involved with a woman with a personality disorder and she will do everything in her power to destroy you, she will lie, cheat, steal, commit other crimes and do everything to erode you.

    You watch famous men and athletes suddenly go off the deep end and destroy their careers, there’s often a woman behind it. These types of women are that toxic.

    If you want a taste of how evil, demonic they are go read http://shrink4men.com/

    The best way to look at feminism is think of it as a personality disorder writ large.

    They are only happy destroying, the suffering of others gives them glee. They are unhappy when others are happy (for example men in male spaces doing male things, or gamers having fun).

    And like any abuser, blaming the victim and telling him it is his fault and he’s the abusive one if rule number one.

  26. Damn I am a knowledge abuser! Maybe they can have some camps that will increase our focus and concentration so we can serve the FI better.

    We could call them “Concentration Camps.” That is the next logical step.

  27. feeriker says:

    It is not just about power. Its about letting women abuse men freely.

    Which makes it ultimately all about power, since “empowered” women (and their ball-less mangina enablers like the ones mentioned in the OP) are proxies/willing useful idiots for the godless Alpha Male power structure behind the War on Men and the destruction of the godly family.

  28. The Question says:

    @ Solomon

    Agreed; the propaganda machine outlets influence how people vote. Unfortunately many of the laws are already in place and will be extremely difficult to abolish, which means getting people to not vote for more of the same isn’t enough to remedy the problem. At some point the current setup will either collapse or require outright tyranny to continue enforce the status quo. I fear the latter will arrive before the former.

  29. jeff says:

    johnmcg,

    You are wrong to “get” why blacks use the n word and whites cannot. Or patriarchy in the past. We are talking about good men. The FI painted and now paints ALL men as abusers just for being male.

    There are MORE violence against women NOW than in the past due to the frustration that the FI has caused. I say more in numbers, but women actually abuse mentally and physically more than men. So to catch you up on realities, in the past the % of male abusers was actually smaller than it is now WITH the FI and all the white knighting etc.

    Again we are talking about good men, not the small % that do abuse. By claiming that in the past men abused women more or that you can see how women think/thought that is incorrect.

    Empath has gone for years challenging people to find pastor sermons that teach forceful submission etc, no one can find one. It’s a myth and to bring up an urban legend that men in the past abused their authority is a complete sham.

    As far as the black calling other blacks the n word, it still disgusting and repulsive. Only a feminist would find it more so from one race than another. If you don’t respect your own race (even if kidding) enough to not denegrate it with a cursory slang word, how do I believe you’ll respect another race.

    ACthinker,

    That sounds pretty feel goody. The point of these blogs is to show how deep seated the FI goes and how subtle the wording and messages of those even in pastoralship who are well regarded by both genders. When the wife says she is submissive and respectful, but isn’t how exactly do you prove this in counseling?

    You would do well to remember that women complain and men comply, also that women say and men do, oh and believe what she does, not what she says. To this degree, men can and will change more readily that is why the FI is working so well….. because men will comply for sex and white knight, men have thousands of years worth of proof that not only will we change to make something work and change our mindset, but we do. Women suffer from myopic solipsism so they have a hard time changing their mindset and moving into action any change that needs to take place.

    I’m sure you’ve read much of the RP, but haven’t grasp the deeper things. Good luck.

  30. @Dalrock:

    “Affection is conditional (denying sex would certainly count here)
    Threatens to end the relationship
    Threatens to take the children.
    Uses partner’s money and/or credit with or without their knowledge.
    Accuses.
    Manipulates.
    Commits mental blackmail.”

    It looks like they just copied their own playbook and made it illegal, but only when men do it. This is exactly what women do in every single divorce case I was involved with (over 100). Of course affection is ALWAYS conditional (after the vows) and threats to end the relationship and take the kids are standard fare. Does ANYBODY know a woman who doesn’t use money without your knowledge or who NEVER accuses, and manipulates? I don’t. Not even close. Wait for it… AWALT!

    Except now they frame it so when men behave like them they are culpable.

    Hey! I wonder how this works out for Trannie Men and Transgender women? If a T-Male withdraws sex from his (her?) T-female (male?) boyfriend/girlfriend that would logically be “abuse” but if a T-female accuses, manipulates, threatens to take the children and then threatens to turn the children against him so he will never see them again and THEN she (he?) makes a provably false sexual molestation charge? Well that must be just fine. What’s the problem. Or does it matter if she (he?) still has a penis? What is the deciding factor in that case? Inquiring minds. I need to take another look at the Extra Protection Claus in the Constitution. Pretty sure it is right next to the abortion and euthanasia clause…

  31. BradA says:

    Greyghost,

    I will not be advising my son to marry or shack up with a woman. If he truly wishes to be fruitful and multiply he will be using surrogacy or an artificial womb fully supported by his father. Stay single my friends.

    I asked this in another thread, but I will repeat it here: Would/will you tell your daughters to be the surrogates for such relationships? What would/will you tell them they will get out of it?

  32. @ BradA, regarding daughters, to be winsome and reject the culture to take up their crosses daily and realize that those that suffer with Him will also reign with Him. What they do after that is on their own heads.

  33. jeff says:

    Empath,

    I meant to make an analogy to your challenge with the myth that women were treated badly, which is a blatantly lie. You can’t say your grandpa drank and beat your grandma and your dad…. therefore all men in the patriarchy model were big, bad meanies.

    The truth of the matter that when women shut up and put out they were well taken care of by any standards compared to the rest of the world as a whole.

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  35. Isa says:

    Why in western culture do people constantly find new ways of becoming victims? They are ever searching for “abuse” or “microagressions” without, of course, the lovely reality of actually experiencing violence or oppression. If there have been any studies or research on this topic I would be very interested. It’s such an odd psychological condition.

  36. ACThinker says:

    @Jeff (oct 27 @2:40),

    Men comply because we are as a group cowards. We wish peace more than we wish justice, or the faux peace of a quiet house.
    I’m simply putting forward the idea that humans individually are not living like Christ which is the real root of the problem here. And I don’t just mean the foot washing Christ, but also the “get a sword” Christ, and the transfigured Christ, and the whips in the temple Christ, and the rabbi Christ who taught in parables, and the judge Christ who said “who ever has not committed this sin can cast the first stone”, and the Christ who went to a cross for his beloved(all of us).
    What I say may sound “feel good” and seem easy, but it has a lot of power behind it, and is frankly very difficult. Can any one here say that they have lived any day of their life without committing sin? Was there a day where they have not violated a commandment – I’d bet at least first for almost everyone. When has a single one of us NOT had another God (our spouse, our computer, our tv, this website, etc)?
    Each of us becoming the active agent in our lives is important. We must live with purpose. Men are a bit better at this then women, which is why when they complain we tend to act. But we must demand this of our women (a harder thing to do). And of our children – also hard.

  37. ACThinker says:

    @Jeff,
    BTW, incase I hadn’t said it, it isn’t Love to allow others to continue to live in self destructive ways uninformed of them – we can’t make them stop but we can help them. And I include manipulation (violation of the commandment to not lie) as a form of self destructive behavior.

  38. BradA says:

    GiL,

    I am more wanting to see what greyghost says since he is the one advocating surrogacy as the only way for males to go. I am truly curious if he is/will be consistent with that advice to his daughters.

  39. BradA says:

    First World Problems Isa.

  40. Yeah, I got that BradA. I suspect we each have our own cross to bear. Different advice for different situations is no double standard. The vast chasm between treatment of men and treatment of women in this culture warrants a vast chasm in advice to individuals falling into those respective camps (IMO).

  41. Ras al Ghul says:

    feeriker says:

    October 27, 2015 at 2:22 pm

    “Which makes it ultimately all about power”

    Arguably everything is ultimately about power freeiker. But there is benign use of power and there is malignant use.

    And there is abuse for the sake of abuse, for the enjoyment of the suffering of others, and there is a strong strain in feminism of wanting and enjoying not just power, but the suffering of men. The mocking, as the demons mock, the plaintive cries of the innocent.

  42. Scott says:

    Making the Power and Control Wheel gender neutral would hide the power imbalances in relationships between men and women that reflect power imbalances in society. By naming the power differences, we can more clearly provide advocacy and support for victims, accountability and opportunities for change for offenders, and system and societal changes that end violence against women.

    During my time at the agency, I had the opportunity to substitute facilitate (when the regular facilitator was out) in a couple of female batterer groups. I was curious about this and asked as much as I could, because they did not like male facilitators running these.

    When asked “why did you batter” a couple of trends emerged:
    1. “I was taught growing up that boys never hit girls and I knew I would get away with it.”
    2. “My brother used to get in way more trouble for hitting me than the other way around.”
    3. “My plan was to tell the police that I was defending myself and I knew they would believe me.”
    In some of the relationships, the women were in the more dominant “male” role. (For a variety of developmental reasons, I suspect).

    I tried to understand these relationship dynamics in sort of “reverse” power and control terms, as I was very invested in the narrative at the time and believed the Duluth model to be, for the most part an accurate way to map out what was happening in these homes.

    Most of the relationships were violent in both directions and both parties were annoyed that the police had become involved at all.

  43. Thornstruck says:

    So Friends of the Family (FotF) are about as helpful as Planned Parenthood is to the womb. That’s good information Dalrock, excellent post.

  44. BradA says:

    Thornstruck,

    It is “Focus on the Family” for the record.

  45. Scott says:

    It should also be noted that there was a ratio of about 8:1 men’s groups to women’s.

    This lopsided ness seemed to be accounted for by the fact that the women had to do something extremely violent, multiple times before they were finally arrested.

    Many of the men were there for pretty silly stuff.

  46. greyghost says:

    Hi BradA glad you asked. My daughters (oldest) are at this time talked to about the type of guy they will be interested in. I also do a lot of shaming of the black beastie type of woman. I also advise her to marry early and avoid the dating thing. (she is only 15 and not the big thing now but nice way to hopefully to cause some thought)
    BradA a question I would ask of you is why would a loving father give advise like that between a male and female child in the same family.

  47. johnmcg says:

    The other part is that these folks get to congratulate themselves for standing up to Power, when in reality, they are doing nothing of the sort.

    You can read http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/30/i-can-tolerate-anything-except-the-outgroup/ for how our culture has produced a cultural elite that congratulates themselves on their tolerance while regularly expressing the strongest intolerance.

  48. JDG (warning - contains "S" words) says:

    jeff says:
    October 27, 2015 at 2:40 pm

    Spot on, especially about the past.

  49. JDG (warning - contains "S" words) says:

    There never was a place or a time where women as a group had it worse than men as a group. To say that women were oppressed by men in the past is one of the greatest lies of feminism. It is also one of the pillars of feminism.

  50. jbro1922 says:

    “black beastie type of woman.”

    GG, what is this?

  51. Jim says:

    ” BradA says:
    October 27, 2015 at 2:50 pm

    I asked this in another thread, but I will repeat it here: Would/will you tell your daughters to be the surrogates for such relationships?”

    Sure why not? It’s about time they made some sacrifices for once. They already have absolute power over their husbands (why men continue to marry these harpies is baffling to me).

  52. Thornstruck says:

    @Brad A
    Good catch, thank you for the clarification.

  53. pancakeloach says:

    “Knowledge abuse,” otherwise known as DARVO.

  54. BradA says:

    That is odd Dalrock. The email system is either sending out emails for moderated posts or you deleting one really quick.

  55. greyghost says:

    jbro1922
    Many black women are the most horrid women overall there is period. The ones in particular are the immersed in African American culture types. All of the things spoken about here are in full play and part of the daily life in the African American community. You tuber Tommy Sotomayor does videos on the subject. At times he mentions the damage of feminism though he is not an MRA type nor do I believe he is aware of the manosphere. To find his videos go to you tube and look up these channels TNNRaw2 , MrMadness Sotomayor, TnnRawNews, HCBW He is really crass so I won’t embed another one of his videos here. To see the lovely selection of hotties available in the “hood” google this and take a look and listen

    Beast Squad ft.Ash Bash – “Beasty Is Back” Dir. by

    These women are not role models for anybody yet they manage to have multiple children

  56. BradA says:

    Greyghost,

    I do not fully know. I would focus mostly on fulfilling the true Biblical commands and not letting emotions control the day, before or after a marriage.

    My children had all rejected me as their father by the time of their teen years, so we will never know how things could have worked. One daughter has done well money wise, but is extremely bitter and controlling. The other is ruining her life with drugs. My sons didn’t listen much either and have their own challenges. I have very limited input into one son and wife’s life, but don’t hesitate to speak the truth to both my son and his wife. I don’t think much of it is sinking in, especially since I am not the “only” father and see myself as more of an older adviser (at times), but I do what I think is profitable.

    Your advice has merit, but doesn’t seem to fit with the other surrogacy insistence. Any clarification on how you reconcile the two would be interesting, to me at least.

    I wish I had children I got to even fail with, but that isn’t how things worked out. That is another issue however. I do get ongoing practice with my wife however….

  57. Dalrock says:

    @BradA

    That is odd Dalrock. The email system is either sending out emails for moderated posts or you deleting one really quick.

    I don’t understand. Did you see a new post that disappeared, or did you have a comment appear and then go away?

  58. jack says:

    With Christian like those, who needs Lucifer?

  59. Anonymous Reader says:

    Pace’ Vox Day, it should now be obvious that “feminists always project”.

  60. Dalrock says:

    @Isa

    Why in western culture do people constantly find new ways of becoming victims? They are ever searching for “abuse” or “microagressions” without, of course, the lovely reality of actually experiencing violence or oppression. If there have been any studies or research on this topic I would be very interested. It’s such an odd psychological condition.

    Victimhood is a source of power in our culture, so there is a competition to see who is the biggest victim. It is perverse. There have been a number of articles on this recently, but unfortunately the only one I can find with a quick search is from June: http://pjmedia.com/eddriscoll/2015/06/19/will-to-power-via-victimhood/

  61. Isa says:

    @Dalrock
    Thanks for that. Turn of the century German philosophers have been the root of all sorts of problems. Granted, they are also dead white males and thus oppressors and shouldn’t be listened to. See, it’s not the philosophy, it’s the white maleness.

  62. feeriker says:

    It is “Focus on the Family” for the record.

    In the interest of truthful disclosure, it should be “Fracturers of the Family.”

  63. American says:

    Don’t marry them, cohabitate with them, have their children or take on the responsibilities of fatherhood for any they may already have. Maintain your optimum position of power and reduce any threats and risk to the absolute minimum. Then, they cannot wreck you. Why? Because they don’t have the power to as you didn’t give it to them.

    If you already have, and Dalrock did the day he came under the body of matrimonial law that legally disempowered him to a material extent for the benefit of one or more others, then cross your fingers and work it the best way you can so you don’t end up in divorce court and open a brand new chapter titled ‘I’m screwed’ in your life.

  64. Tom C says:

    We need these laws because there are so many more abusive men than abusive women. If a man commits an abusive act against a woman and is criminalized for it, but a woman commits the same abusive act against a man and is not, then no crime has been committed when the woman does it. And so we have more abusive men. And that’s why we need these laws…

  65. Heresolong says:

    Maybe much like only white people can be racist, only men can be abusers.

  66. gargoylevrigin01 says:

    @Crackers says:
    “How does Christian marriage exist in this world? Unless you plan on shutting your bride in a closet for the entirety of her life, I don’t see how a modern woman wouldn’t be brainwashed through all the institutions with this shit.”

    This reminds me of that song that goes: “Some boys take a beautiful girl and hide her away from the rest of the world. I want to be the one to walk in the sunlight…”

    I am going to make a serious comment on this article later on.

  67. mike says:

    This is why you must never go to a marriage counselor and allow another man to dictate the terms for you. Total loss of frame. Marriage suicide. You can’t “talk out” your unattractiveness to your wife and cause her to suddenly realize why you are attractive.

    Maybe Dalrock could make a list of some approved books that won’t insert these marriage-sabotaging ideas into the wife and husband. It seems like my church is always trying to form a couple’s study around some new marriage advice book. Unfortunately, they all seem to be riddled with garbage.

    The only long-term option is maintaining your attractiveness and making sure you pick a wife that has proven resistant to feminist ideology and doesn’t hate the word “submit”.

  68. @ feeriker

    It is “Focus on the Family” for the record.

    In the interest of truthful disclosure, it should be “Fracturers of the Family.”

    Focus on the Feminine
    Focus on the Female

    Take your pick.

  69. hoenycomb says:

    Free speech good for me .. and not for you .. these are your future beta’s ready to bend over and take it (re: FotF directives).

    http://www.nationalreview.com/article/426129/poll-says-students-support-censoring-politically-incorrect-speech

  70. adamalan says:

    Its not about abuse, its about power. Women in control: normal. Man in control: abuse. Its about enforcing the matriarchy; even if they have to destroy your life, lock you up, or kill you to do it.

    A Biblical marriage is abusive in their eyes. Yet women’s creation betrays them, they are happiest in a marriage with the man firmly in control.

    This is why the ‘abuse’ card should no longer hold sway over us.

  71. Morpholony says:

    This is eerie. I went through this EXACTLY during my divorce. My now ex-wife went to counseling where they coached her in how to call out her husband (me) for being emotionally abusive. This is pretty much opposite of the way things were. Pretty much all our friends defended me, but this just proved to her that I was “influencing” them because of the power dynamic, and that because nobody believed her, well, that PROVED that I was a dangerous abuser.

    When I mentioned that our friends all thought that she had been emotionally abusing me, and that her behavior fit the profile in the books she asked me to read, she moved out. Why? Since I explained to her the double standard, therefore she was unsafe to be around such abusive behavior.

    Now, happily divorced. It’s amazing the weight that lifted off my shoulders once I noticed that I was alone in the house.

  72. Dalrock, have any marriage counselors or licensed therapists tried to contact you to “correct you” in anyway or even “threaten you” with legal action as a result of your righteous attack upon their infernal professions? You really are doing the Lord’s work here sir, I just can’t imagine that no one with a professional credential hasn’t tried to STOP YOU in some way.

  73. Any of you watching this game? This is ridiculous! Half of New York City will be 2+ hours late for work tomorrow.

  74. Boxer says:

    Dear Dalrock:

    Thanks for a(nother) excellent article.

    These folks know exactly what they are doing, and they have spent decades perfecting their methodology to do so. Don’t fall for the same mistake so many other men have made of assuming they are actually acting in (perhaps misguided) good faith, or that this is actually about abuse. It is not, it is about destroying headship by taking power away from husbands and giving it to their wives.

    This is something I’ve argued before on this forum, and I’ve always been amazed at the people who want to give the benefit of the doubt to these cretins who make their living destroying your families and making your children bastards. I don’t know exactly how the profits break down in any of these cases, but there are a lot of shysters and hucksters who are clearly motivated to peddle feminism.

    I wonder what the biblical penalty ought to be, for a meddling asshole who makes his living breaking up families? Not that anyone should answer this in print. Purely hypothetical question. A bit of θεωρία on a cool fall evening…

    Regards,

    Boxer

  75. Boxer says:

    Dear FreeRiker and Deep Strength:

    Yeah, they’re Focused on The Family all right. Think of them as any other slow moving parasite. It first infects its host and makes it sick, then it feeds on the slowly dying organism, gaining strength as the host expires and rots. Once one family is rendered down into its least common denominators, it moves on to any other potential host that draws near.

    Regards,

    Boxer

  76. Jason Lee says:

    On victim culture…

    This:
    http://righteousmind.com/where-microaggressions-really-come-from/

    And this infamous quote:

    “…when they make victimhood a coveted status that confers privileges, victims proliferate.”

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/george-will-college-become-the-victims-of-progressivism/2014/06/06/e90e73b4-eb50-11e3-9f5c-9075d5508f0a_story.html

    Of course this phenomenon is not limited to college campuses

  77. @Boxer

    And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me. But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
    (Mat 18:5-6)

  78. Exfernal says:

    @Morpholony

    It seems you have been ‘kafkatrapped’.

  79. Easttexasfatboy says:

    Gents, MGTOW is looking better and better, isn’t it? And the situation will only get worse as the day draws near. Going to be a rough ride.

  80. J1J2 says:

    The soul-ripping paradox of female existence is that the human desire to have power/status contradicts the female desire to have males with higher power/status. Feminism is, necessarily and inevitably, a movement to reduce the attractiveness of men, and it is understandable if women have mixed feelings about this. As the movement achieves even modest success in rendering men not as “non-behaviorally alpha” as they used to be (particularly in education and early earning power), the female attraction module has little choice, if historic tingle levels are to be maintained, but to start demanding that men be “behaviorally alpha”: Bad Boy. And that is what has happened.

  81. Pingback: God’s secret plan for every married man’s life. | Dalrock

  82. jbro1922 says:

    GG,

    Thanks for the info! I agree, it is not attractive.

  83. BradA says:

    Dalrock, I had a message from John that linked this thread. No such post was here that I found. I can copy the post emailed to me if desired.

  84. BradA says:

    Boxer,

    I would lean toward tar and feathers as Instapundit often mentions.

    This reminds me of some of what Paul writes in the Epistles about false teachers.

  85. greyghost says:

    jbro1922
    you are welcome
    BradA
    you have a reply in I think new comment policy thread.

  86. BradA says:

    Dalrock,

    Here is the details from the email:

    John commented on Way ahead of you.

    then

    My wife is abusive by this list. If she approves of my behavior then she is enthusiastic in bed, flirty and affectionate. If not then she is polite but not warm. She claims that it is not manipulation but that she behaves differently when she’s happy. I can choose between doing what I want and having a wife who is civil and nothing more and doing what she wants and getting a happy wife. Sounds like manipulation to me.

    The email said this was comment 192405, in case that matters.

  87. warlock314 says:

    My first wife was a virgin, raised by a good family, well educated, went to church, but believed that a woman should control her husband.

    My current wife is an ex-prostitute, raised by a wicked family, barely educated, and participated in voodoo ritualistic orgies, but firmly believes in submission to her husband.

    Can anyone guess which marriage was hell on earth and which one is like a glimpse of heaven?

  88. BradA says:

    Yeah, right.

  89. Anon133 says:

    What exactly constitutes mental blackmail? Could use an example.

  90. Spike says:

    Angry Harry also noted that the giving of unwanted gifts was also a form of abuse:

  91. BradA says:

    Dalrock, I just found the post I got the email about. The email had it way out of order or I was out in space. I could have sworn it was not here when I posted my notes about it.

    Not a huge deal, just confused me a bit.

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