He came to teach.

Commenter Know How isn’t yet married, but this didn’t stop him from explaining that I and others have it all wrong in his response to my post Romance 101: How to stop frustrating your wife. As with another recent comment in response to that post, I pulled it to moderation to avoid derailing the discussion on that post.  However, since I don’t have a new post handy and in the interest of allowing Know How a platform to share his armchair husband wisdom I’m posting it here.

“Cooking breakfast and getting into bed” is not what makes a wife. When a man makes the statement about “discussing her feminity”, that sounds like he intends to change her. We don’t want women to change us, why do we expect them to allow us to change them? According to what many women will tell you, they are not created to cook, clean, and have sex. They are our helpmeets, not our slaves. My dad is a marriage therapists with 47 years of practice. I grew up with a house full of sisters and one brother, so the two of us, have heard and seen it all and certainly admit that we can be at fault a lot more times than the woman.

Many of you here are somewhat skewed in your attitudes. It is not the way real men would approach the problems in relationships. Some things that we should not fall into the trap of is, making bad jokes, demeaning them, and expecting them not to react, to our demeaning and belittling. This is some of what gave rise to feminsts. They got tired of us limiting them and being too dominant. Women are people, not animals. Omit the jokes about spanking and the attitude about a woman wanting a career. I love my girlfriend and try to keep check of my behavior and expect for her to check herself, but I certainly do not want a passive woman without goals. We will be married after Christmas.

Everything in the relationship is not about her, nor about me. We both want to be respected and romanced. A decent balance is needed and the only way you will keep the relationship working is to be fair to her and not expect for her to bow down to you.

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119 Responses to He came to teach.

  1. thegreatshebang says:

    Thank you for posting this. Made my day!

  2. TFH says:

    Are you certain that ‘Know How’ is a ‘he’?

    From this comment, the gender of the poster is not clear at all…

  3. TFH says:

    As in, a woman could have written this, pretending to be a man….

  4. It’s funny how people who make equalitarian claims like, “We both want to be respected and romanced. A decent balance is needed,” always end up contradicting their own words sooner or later: “I grew up with a house full of sisters and one brother, so the two of us, have heard and seen it all and certainly admit that we can be at fault a lot more times than the woman.”

    Just another example of men and women being equal, but women are more equal than men.

    Omit the jokes about spanking

    Why does he think we’re joking?

    We will be married after Christmas.

    Would it be unkind to start a pool?

  5. Luke says:

    “making bad jokes, demeaning them, and expecting them not to react, to our demeaning and belittling. This is some of what gave rise to feminsts.”

    I have better candidates to explain that. Of course contraception, decline of Christianity, the increased acceptance of the tenets of socialism, negative eugenics and decreased quality of schooing for decades resulting in stupider people — all these have a role. The best one that’s not widely known, though, would have to be from Rich Zubaty’s “What Men Know That Women Don’t”. He points out that prior to agriculture the average woman had about 10 menstrual cycles. (This was due to later menarche, more pregnancies, commonly extended lactation, as well as shorter life expectancies.) Now, the average Western woman has roughly 400 menstrual cycles. That means women are having their thinking marred by (and are taking it out on men) roughly 40 times as much PMS as there should be. This is where not just feminists, but the Valerie Solanuses (notorious for writing “The SCUM Manifesto”, harsher on men than anything the Nazis ever wrote about Jews) likely come from. That, and the observable fact that most of the best-known feminist women all had a lousy marriage (or their mothers did).

  6. YOHAMI says:

    “We don’t want women to change us [...] have heard and seen it all and certainly admit that we can be at fault a lot more times than the woman.”

    Whats the point on saying women are [better] than men if he doesn’t want men to change? except he does:

    “It is not the way real men…”

    Somebody save him.

    “We will be married after Christmas.”

    “He” is down for a rough ride. Good luck.

  7. sunshinemary says:

    They got tired of us limiting them and being too dominant. Women are people, not animals. Omit the jokes about spanking and the attitude about a woman wanting a career. I love my girlfriend and try to keep check of my behavior and expect for her to check herself, but I certainly do not want a passive woman without goals. We will be married after Christmas.

    Everything in the relationship is not about her, nor about me. We both want to be respected and romanced. A decent balance is needed and the only way you will keep the relationship working is to be fair to her and not expect for her to bow down to you.

    I see years of involuntary marital celibacy in this young man’s future. Someday he’ll be skulking back here wanting to know exactly what is was that we were saying about spanking again…

  8. Cautiously Pessimistic says:

    I see years of involuntary marital celibacy in this young man’s future.

    On the bright side, it does read like a woman pretending to be a man, so “he” may not have to experience that particular hell. But given what men are taught, its not inconceivable it’s a guy who’s a good study. In which case, yeah, bookmark this site for later. I was like you growing up. When your marriage is on the cusp of destruction, you may wish to consider that everything you’ve been taught is wrong, and you should try a different approach.

  9. lgrobins says:

    Overall this just sounds like a typical naive kid about to get married who thinks he/she has it all figured out. Blue pill, ignorant and in bliss.

    “They got tired of us limiting them and being too dominant.”
    Too domineering works better, for most women you can never be too dominant.

    “…expect for her to check herself, but I certainly do not want a passive woman without goals.”
    A lot of women are not capable of checking themselves. This doesn’t make her weak–just woman. Some may need strong guidance and oversight in a loving, gentle, dominant manner.

  10. Oblivion says:

    “the only way you will keep the relationship working is to be fair to her and not expect for her to bow down to you”

    It doesnt get much more beta than this. This is a post from an FTB
    FTB=Full Tilt Beta

  11. Women would rather be objectified than idealized.

    Once you learn that you will Know How.

  12. Tilikum says:

    its hard to think with all that estrogen flooding your system.

  13. Ev says:

    I would really like to read a guest post by this alleged “marriage therapists (sic) with 47 years of practice.”

  14. TFH says:

    If this person is really a man, then we must not mock him, but rather cherish his crucial role in keeping the current setup going :

    Pickup artists want to have sex with women.
    Women want to have sex with pickup artists.
    Manginas like Know How get to pay the bills!

    Everybody wins!

    Everybody gets to attain their basic aspirations, so everybody wins. Especially Know How, who gets to man up, step up, and take responsibility. He gets to improve the life of a woman, by financing her goals.

    We should cherish the crucial role he plays in financing this setup, so that this win-win-win equilibrium is possible.

  15. TFH says:

    sunshinemary,

    I see years of involuntary marital celibacy in this young man’s future.

    For all we know, he and his bride to be are both 35, and he bought into the narrative that she is reborn as ‘traditional’ and thus her partner count has magically been reset from 23 to 0.

  16. teemeel says:

    I see nothing but straw men:

    Cooking breakfast and getting into bed is not what makes a wife. Nobody said that it does.

    They are our helpmeets, not our slaves. Nobody said they were our slaves.

    According to what many women will tell you, they are not created to cook, clean, and have sex. Nobody is saying that is the sole purpose of their creation. Christian response: They were created to glorify God.

    Women are people, not animals Who is saying a woman isn’t a person?

    But, Commenter Know how does try to qualify himself, lest you think he is out of his element:

    My dad is a marriage therapists with 47 years of practice. I grew up with a house full of sisters and one brother, so the two of us, have heard and seen it all and certainly admit that we can be at fault a lot more times than the woman. My dad is an engineer; ergo, listen to my theories on aerodynamics. I have sisters, so let me tell you about romance. The logic just flows…

    This is some of what gave rise to feminsts. They got tired of us limiting them and being too dominant.

    Did you notice that feminism started its true ascension when masculinity was on the slow decline? As if feminism was the response to the crushing patriarchy.

    Omit the jokes about spanking and the attitude about a woman wanting a career. My girl loves spanking jokes. As far as the career goes, I don’t want career competition. Because I’ve seen how poorly that can go.

  17. It depends on frame of reference. From a Christian perspective the husband and wife relationship is like that of Christ and the church. Therefore, wives are only slaves to husbands as the Church is a slave to Christ. Unfortunately for the feminist perspective there are many verses that indicate that we are to think of ourselves as slaves to Christ.

  18. slwerner says:

    TFH – “For all we know, he and his bride to be are both 35″

    True. He/she does not state his/her age. But, does not that his/her father has 47 years of practice as a therapist. Assuming old dad was a real hustler, and got his act together very quickly, and got started in his practice at the age of 21 (highly unlikely, BTW); that would mean that dear old dad is now 68+. And, while its possible for a man to have children in his late 40′s, most of his generation did not wait so long to have children. More likely he would have had this child by age 33, putting our self-esteemed poster at…~35.

    And, really, the original post does seem to be crafted from the female perspective. But, to be fair, if his father is a marriage therapist**, then he’s probably been fed a steady does of “men are always to blame – even if their wives sleep with every man in town” pseudo-philosophy. So. perhaps adopting a gynocentric view was to be expected.

    ** I cannot read the word therapist without thinking of Darrel Hammond playing Sean Connery on SNL’s Celebrity Jeopardy, selecting the category “Therapists” by asking for “The Rapists for 100″

  19. Squawketh the Common Blue-orbed beta.

    This is nothing more than beta-game: effeminate efforts to appeal to the feminist imperative.

  20. ahlstar says:

    See you in a year or two after you’ve been chewed up and shat out of the divorce machine. Thanks for your contribution. Let us know if Daddy’s profession was any help.

  21. crowhill says:

    My dad is a marriage therapists with 47 years of practice.

    This got me wondering what it is that keeps a marriage therapist in business. Obviously it’s repeat business — either from existing clients or new clients. So either he gets people hooked on therapy, or he has good marketing know-how.

    Neither of those things necessarily mean that he gives good advice.

    I don’t mean to criticize Know How’s dad. He might be a genius. I’m just pointing out that “47 years of practice” does not necessarily mean that what he says has any value, or actually solves anyone’s problems.

  22. JCclimber says:

    Well, he *did* say that his father was a marital therapist.

    It’s almost 100% certain that his head has been filled with pure bullshit about how marital dynamics work, that men are almost always to blame for any relationship problems, and that women are awesome princess geniuses who shouldn’t be held to any real standards, because sexisss.

    Sorry, little boy, your daddy lied to you for every day of your life. Lied, bamboozled, fooled, tricked, brainwashed, and used you like a 30 day old tampon. I feel for the pain you’re going to experience starting around the 6 month mark of your marriage, so just around June of 2014.

  23. I’m sure Know How thinks he means well, but he is in no position to tell Dalrock or any of the married men on this site anything about how marriage works or doesn’t work. The fact that he can’t get that means that he is either NOT a “he”, he is very young (and naive), or he isn’t being sincere (has an ulterior motive.)

    I’ve known quite a few marriage therapists and they would be the first to admit that men and women don’t think alike and sometimes men and women have to behave very differently in marriage to make it work. He is right that people don’t typically change, but he hasn’t done a very good job demonstrating that he knows women all the well (certianly not in how they ineract with men whom they love and respect.)

  24. Eidolon says:

    slwerner – he’s probably been fed a steady does of “men are always to blame – even if their wives sleep with every man in town” pseudo-philosophy

    I’m sorry sir, your cynicism isn’t strong enough and has been overcome by events:

    http://www.slate.com/articles/double_x/doublex/2013/11/cheating_on_your_spouse_might_just_save_your_marriage.html

    Now the woman cheating is good for a marriage. She did it for him and the children, you see.

  25. slwerner says:

    Eidolon – “She did it for him and the children, you see.”

    Hopefully Know How will keep this in mind when his new wife begins to “do good” for their marriage:)

  26. Michael says:

    I don’t see anything wrong with his comments. He seems like a really nice guy with good inclinations and noble intentions who loves his fiancée and is looking forward to his marriage. Seems fine to me.

  27. Ton says:

    Women are not animals, animals are loyal.

  28. slwerner says:

    Micheal – “I don’t see anything wrong with his comments.”

    If taken in a vacuum, they seem naive, but not offensive. But, do consider that they were in response to the discussion thread on nearly year-old post. One might suspect that they were more specifically in response to some of the later comments made on that particular thread, which appear to have been largely about women blowing up marriages, and how men should stand strong in the face of misbehaving women. In such light, a guy who’s never even experience marriage to a modern women telling men facing marital issues that, “Many of you here are somewhat skewed in your attitudes. It is not the way real men would approach the problems in relationships.”, come off quite differently than those same words in a vacuum.

  29. zykos says:

    Seems like everything will go well for them in equality-land, until the kids arrive, as is usually the case. And that’s the greatest tragedy of this setup, things will turn sour when everything he has is already invested in a woman and child who find him weak.

  30. Sun Xhu says:

    Michael – Yeah…
    He’s your typical gamma, pedestalizing women. If you don’t see anything wrong with his comments, you are in the same boat.

    Seek help, here and elsewhere.

  31. Tom H says:

    A woman with a career has a high probability of infertility relative to those who stay home.
    Women typically dig a guy with confidence who is fat, bald, and old over a guy who’s a young, ripped faker. Been there, done that. Good character helps a lot with confidence building. Pushing women to have sex shows a lack of good character, so you will lose confidence if you have to push. Wait for an invitation–or–better yet, ask your lady to marry and create a protective environment. Yeah, show leadership and dominance, but protective at the same time and women will drool over you. Been there, done that. A chivalrous knight is a leader, dominant, and protective. He doesn’t push a woman to have sex, but her panties just drop. Of course, only in the context of marriage can a knight be truly protective. A knight explains how men’s minds work–the more love-making, the more emotional intimacy. Proper love-making takes about an hour and the man delays his pleasure until the end. It takes a lot of self-control, but the ladies love it. The techniques and strategies are in my book, which is in process.

    My wife sent me out dancing in order to lose weight and get energy from social gatherings (I’m an extrovert and therefore get energy from being around people). I went without my wedding ring cause I couldn’t find it after taking it off years ago when it ceased to fit and I had to beat the ladies off with a stick! Been married 34 years and I love my wife and my word, but I love my word more than my wife, so I keep my vows. I finally got a replacement ring and we’ll see how well it works. I know it doesn’t keep all women away, but hopefully I’ll get a little more peace and quiet now.

    Oh, I’ve lost 23 lbs. in four weeks by eating two servings of veggies at lunch and dinner and exercising every day. The veggies really help with sugar craving. I make the mixed veggies tasty with a little cheese, bacon, and spices. With spinach I use balsamic vinegar.

  32. Fred Flange says:

    The one accidental kernel of truth in there is that he cannot “change” her, nor she him. That is what qualification is all about. Of course, he COULD come around and change himself, but that’s it; ditto for her, she can only change herself if she chooses.

    Maybe they’ll be lucky and both be good obedient beta-folk, galumphing along just well enough to be too afraid to stray out of their coop. Even though the sex becomes drip-fed, out of ennui, or especially if a puppy or two is squeezed out.

  33. slwerner says:

    Tom H – “A woman with a career has a high probability of infertility relative to those who stay home.”

    ???

    I’m assuming you meant infidelity?

    But, either way, neither statement seems to fit with the rest of your comment. Perhaps you could expand upon whichever statement you were making?

    Frankly, I don’t see anything to suggest that career women have significantly higher levels of either infertility nor infidelity. There have been plenty of stay-at-home wives who been cheaters; and, unless you were specifically making reference to career women waiting until it’s too late to try to have children, then just having a job vs. working at home isn’t likely to affect a given women’s fertility at a given age.

    I don’t mean to be snarky, just wondering what you were getting-at there.

  34. TFH says:

    I wish we could know if this third-gender subject of this article, has read the article.

    Too many times, we just don’t know if the person being dismantled has seen the article that dismantles him/her. Same goes for articles about Glenn Stanton, Mark Driscoll, Sheila Gregoire, etc.

  35. quipper says:

    This is what I have lived by for 15 years to stay married and happy as a man. Most women will fall right in line. I call it the give four shits rule to stay married.

    Handle your shit.
    Call her on her shit.
    Out of her, fuck the shit.
    Keep house and family safe from shit.

  36. Johnycomelately says:

    “My dad is a marriage therapists with 47 years of practice.”

    Says it all, going off the bat of several thousand divorced guys that went to marriage therapists, it’s always the husbands fault.

  37. Feminist Hater says:

    His fiancee has probably already found herself with plenty of other men. Seems this chap was beaten over the head by his sisters enough times to believe that men are absolutely useless and always at fault.

    Reality will be a kicker, divorce is almost a certainty if they do eventually get married.

  38. Feminist Hater says:

    At least he will have his therapist father to be scolded by as his marriage falls apart around him.

  39. Feminist Hater says:

    The higher infertility of working women is related to the stress of work and age at the time of trying to conceive. Something that stay at home mothers face less. As for infidelity, a working women is surrounded by working alphas… anyone can see where that goes.

  40. Spacetraveller says:

    Perhaps he (if it really *is* a he) didn’t really ‘come to teach’, Dalrock. He expressed an opinion, just like anyone else.

    We can perhaps see plenty wrong with his argument, granted…but still…

    I also thought, like Michael, what exactly is wrong with what he says? It seems fair enough to me…

    But slwerner makes a great point that ON THE FACE OF IT, it may seem fine, but when you examine the comment both in the context of the post in which he commented, and also in the wider (current) male-female interaction atmosphere, this man may be blinded by the love which he has for his girlfriend (which is a good thing, I am not bashing that!!). But prudence…my friend!

    What he says very much depends on the girl…does she have the same good intentions which HE seems to have?
    That is the question…

    That said, I wish the soon-to-be-married couple every blessing for their upcoming marriage. However misguided he may be, he may well have chosen a worthy bride…who knows?

  41. feeriker says:

    My dad is a marriage therapists[sic] with 47 years of practice. I grew up with a house full of sisters and one brother…

    That explains everything.

  42. earl says:

    “When a man makes the statement about “discussing her feminity”, that sounds like he intends to change her.”

    I wonder what will happen the first time she tells him to Man Up™.

  43. TFH says:

    slwerner,

    that would mean that dear old dad is now 68+. And, while its possible for a man to have children in his late 40′s, most of his generation did not wait so long to have children. More likely he would have had this child by age 33, putting our self-esteemed poster at…~35.

    Good catch. While there is some chance that mangina boy is as young as 28, there is an equal chance he is 42. We ought to take the median of 35, and assume his blushing, newly virginal bride is also ~35.

    Heh… remember those old cars with analog odometers that had only 5 digits? Once you crossed 100,000, the odometer read ’00,000′ again. The unsavvy were actually fooled if the body and upholstery were fully detailed and renewed.

  44. This is some of what gave rise to feminsts. They got tired of us limiting them and being too dominant

    But not all women are feminists.

  45. His fiance is looking over his shoulder as he types this laughing her ass off, and making sure he says the right things. Meanwhile, she’s looking forward to the days when sex with Know How to Be Whipped are going to be over, and she’ll get to collect alimony and child support from him, along with the mistress fees from her new lover.

    Come on back to the Manosphere when you get tired of the taste of her ass on your tongue, son. We’ll keep a light on for ya.

  46. Tom H says:

    No, I meant infertility. The fact is, college-educated women have lower fertility rates than those who aren’t college-educated.http://papers.ccpr.ucla.edu/papers/PWP-CCPR-2012-012/PWP-CCPR-2012-012.pdf College-educated women tend to be career women (obviously). Ipso facto, career women have lower fertility rates than stay at home moms who are less likely to be college educated. Stay-at-home moms tend to be less well educated and more fertile than college-educated women. http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2009-10-02/news/0910010961_1_stay-at-home-mothers-soccer-mom-balance-work-and-family

    Because they are likely to focus on their career instead of motherhood, career women are more likely to abort than stay at home moms since pregnancy tends to harm careers (obviously). Single women are more likely to experience PID than married women (again, obviously). PID is a major cause of infertility as is age. http://www.womenshealth.gov/publications/our-publications/fact-sheet/infertility.html Because career women tend to delay child-bearing, they are more likely to be infertile when they want children.

    You are spot on that this comment isn’t related to the rest of my post. It was just an observation that needs to be paid attention to. It is politically correct to ignore it, which is commonly the case even though it should be on the news front and center with a lot of frequency since it’s a major problem. Who is warning of the problem? Who is working on it and telling us about what is being looked at? Anybody?

  47. earl says:

    “Some things that we should not fall into the trap of is, making bad jokes, demeaning them, and expecting them not to react, to our demeaning and belittling. ”

    What?

    I always thought making bad jokes, demeaning statements, and belitting was to ENTICE a reaction. I never expected a nonreaction from a woman.

  48. slwerner says:

    Tom H – ”The fact is, college-educated women have lower fertility rates than those who aren’t.”
    You seem to be conflating fertility (as evidence by birthing children) with an antonym expressed as infertility; which is more commonly used to describe a medical condition .

    Being childless does not necessarily mean that a woman was infertile, but rather that her fertility was never brought to fruition. I believe that the proper antonym of fertility would be childlessness.

    I suppose that I also tend to view the physical (medical) condition of infertility and involuntary childlessness as being to separate matters – and even addressed the issue of “career” women delaying until they are simply too old to conceive. Yet, they were not necessarily infertile at a younger age than non-working women.

    The better explanation/argument of/for higher rates of (medical) infertility (at a given age) for working women is the second one you give. Working women are more likely to have greater numbers of sexual partners (or, as we tend to say, is more likely to have ridden the carousel), and are thus is more likely to have contracted a venereal disease which would lead to infertility, such as pelvic inflammatory disease, as you note.

    I don’t mean to dismiss your point about lower fertility rates seen with working women, I suppose I just got hung-up on the technicality of lower fertility rates not being the same thing as higher rates of (actual, medical/physical) infertility.

    And sorry for any derailing I caused.

  49. slwerner says:

    Earl – “I always thought making bad jokes, demeaning statements, and belitting was to ENTICE a reaction.”

    I suppose the opposite of a husband who gives his wife a few negs is the guy (like Know How seems to be) who basically worships and pedistallizes his wife. But, experience (that is, real experience, not the advice handed down from sisters and marital therapists) indicates that wives do generally appreciate getting playful negs.

    I would have to imagine that not only would a man never criticizing his wife lead to her disrespecting him, but even his constantly halving to walk on eggshells so as to never cause any offense via a negative comment would, itself, put a huge strain on their relationship.

  50. Random Angeleno says:

    His heart may be in the right place, but his head definitely isn’t.
    Sounds like me way back when. It did not end well for me nor for many I knew.
    Red pill reality has a way of slapping men like this upside the head. Like it did me. Sometimes it does worse things than that. I count my lucky stars I got off lightly.

    @Know How, we’ll keep the back door light on for you.

  51. earl says:

    It’s times like this (and in my own experiences)…that this verse is in the Bible.

    Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall.

    Proverbs 16:18

  52. Dale says:

    As far as the replacement ring is conserned, a PUA tactic is to wear a wedding ring as a sign of preselection (no need to get married, the jewerly stores don’t check.)

  53. Martian Bachelor says:

    Damn, Earl, we’re on the same wavelength… I thought that pride-before-a-fall adage was in the bible.

    WRT marrying career women, an associate editor at Forbes by the name of Noer wrote an article in Aug of ’06 on all the reasons why men shouldn’t marry them (apart from the generic Divorce 2.0 ass-raping aspects). Of course the thing blew up and led to there being Forbes Woman. If I recall, he had the stats on something like ten or a dozen downsides, fertility and fidelity problems being just two of them, the putative upsides being well publicized.

    If the eebil patriarchy was doing its job there’d be warning labels.

  54. Eidolon says:

    To give a more thorough answer to Know How:

    It’s nice that you want to defend your lady’s honor and make sure people don’t look down on women and that sort of thing. What you need to understand is that people here aren’t saying the things they’re saying because they hate women or look down on them. Dalrock and many others love their wives deeply, in a way you haven’t experienced yet because you haven’t been married yet.

    What you don’t understand, because you haven’t had to deal with your girlfriend 24/7 (and/or she’s been on her best behavior) is that women are far more subject to their emotions than you think. You think, down deep, that she’s pretty similar to you in this regard. Most guys do. It’s not true.

    You probably think that if you just treat her well, take good care of her materially, and love her, that will be enough. This is also not really true. Sure, most women won’t end up divorcing their husbands, but then most people who run with the bulls don’t get gored. It’s important to understand the risks and learn to minimize them, especially when they’re very grave risks.

    People these days won’t tell you this, indeed they’ll tell you the opposite, but women like to be led, and they like to feel like their man is in control. You can’t understand that, because it’s very foreign to your way of thinking. That’s why blogs like this are needed, to help men understand the things about women that women themselves can’t articulate.

    I can almost guarantee you that your wife is a lot less like you than you think she is. This blog is dedicated to helping husbands understand what women are really like, not so we can look down on them or manipulate them, but so we can take care of them, protect them, and make them happier.

  55. Eidolon says:

    Also, your wife will tell you she wants to be treated exactly as you described. However, if you proceed to treat her that way, she will be, at best, a bit unsatisfied, and at worst she’ll cheat and/or want a divorce. She wants you to know to actually treat her differently than she says she wants you to treat her.

    Does that make sense to you? Seems crazy, doesn’t it? But it is how women think. Part of what she wants is for you to know that you should treat her a certain way, regardless of what she says she wants. Do you ever wonder why women go for a certain type of guy, even though those men are nothing like what they say they want? Do you think it’s an accident? It isn’t. Those men don’t listen to what women tell them they want, they act in the way women like. And they have no shortage of women who want to be with them for that reason.

    That’s the kind of thing that this blog among others can help you to understand.

  56. Michael says:

    @ Eidolon

    “She wants you to know to actually treat her differently than she says she wants you to treat her.”

    -Maddening

  57. Oblivion says:

    just wanted to throw my 2 cents into the working women have lower fertility discussion. the family car with 50,000 miles is sitting at your house. there is the same exect car with the same exact miles on it but it is a rental car. If u had to drive cross country through the desert, which one would u feel more comfortable taking? The car with less stress and less drivers is going to function alot better. this is why alot of career women end up stranded in the desert (late 30′s childless) with no water (man)

  58. Drew says:

    Dalrock. Just wanted to let you know that I ripped off a bunch of your material for a sermon. Since you prefer to remain anonymous, couldn’t really credit you. Don’t worry, I didn’t outright plagiarize and I certainly did my own research, I’m not that lazy. Send me an email if you want a copy of the notes.

  59. MarcusD says:

    Well, semantic analysis of the text suggests the writer is a female (~75% chance) between the ages of 35 and 60 (~81% chance), with feminist tendencies (~65% chance).

  60. Dohn Joe says:

    “We will be married after Christmas.

    Would it be unkind to start a pool?”

    Cail that is plainly hilarious! In all fairness though, sometimes it takes a serious shock to the system to delete the programming. I had worked hard to give her the life she wanted, a $55,000 wedding, $65,000 SUV, did my share of the chores, gave he all the TLC she wanted (not easy when you work hard and she’s needy), I bought us a $275,000 home, then a $425,000 one when she thought the last one was too small, then a $650,000 one when she was unhappy with the previous. This took some serious financial effort and savvy to avoid unmanageable debt on a salary which ranged from $60,000 to $88,000 during our marriage, and IMHO, went completely unappreciated. My shock came when I found out my “wife” of 5 years (11 years together total) had been cheating like a fiend! She had banged her boss, my neighbour, even this lazy incompetent know-it-all contractor renovating our basement who I had to give hell to and later take to court. She knew this – she knew I hated that prick! You have any idea how deep that betrayal runs? I divorced and in the process discovered the younger of my 2 boys isn’t my biological offspring yet this crazy b!tch, for whom I blame my eldest son’s attachment disorder on her random sex stops, was awarded custody. I now live in what amounts to a college dormroom as all my cash goes to support her (under the guise of “child support”, a term I refuse to use due to a lack of auditing/accountability it can only be deliberate, a decent chunk of which goes to her newboyfriend’s truck payments). All in all I’m surprised I had the will power to keep from killing anyone throughout all of this, it wasn’t easy. My shrink helped me through a lot of it – thank God for meds!

  61. Dohn Joe says:

    As a followup to my post above: What was that about women being people and not animals?

    HA!

  62. feeriker says:

    Ton said Women are not animals, animals are loyal.

    Another gold nugget, Ton. That makes the second time in two weeks that I’ve added one of your gems to my collection of “Quotable Quotes” (with full attribution, of course).

  63. TFH says:

    MarcusD,

    Well, semantic analysis of the text suggests the writer is a female (~75% chance) between the ages of 35 and 60 (~81% chance),

    I knew it !!

    with feminist tendencies (~65% chance).

    Just 65%? Seems like 100%.

  64. Oblivion says:

    “My dad is a marriage therapists with 47 years of practice”

    how many relationships came to your fathers practice to die?? sins of the father will be passed down to the children.

  65. Feminist Hater says:

    http://www.france24.com/en/20131114-anger-new-zealand-close-legs-rape-defence

    Another reason you simply don’t interact or help women at all. I was all against rape when as a man you could be aware if the women didn’t want to have sex, i.e. she struggled against her rapist. Now it is a situation where anything could be rape and a lawyer raising the defense of ‘she didn’t say no or she was consensual and didn’t voice disagreement or she didn’t try to stop me’ is tried in the court of public rhetoric and cannot be allowed.

    Meh, you can talk about not hating women as much as you like but the above kinda proves that it won’t help you one bit. Avoiding them is the only approach.

  66. Feminist Hater says:

    I mean really??? You could even have a contract given to her asking her whether she wants sex or not. She could sign and mark ‘yes’ but then simply retract that answer, make the contract void and charge you with rape by simply saying that in the middle of the encounter, she didn’t want sex anymore but didn’t voice complaint or disagreement and didn’t ‘close her legs’ because she was ‘scared’ of you…

    On and on, I’m sorry, all the Christian geniuses in here, you try and get your minds around that one and get back to me…

  67. Feminist Hater says:

    Ahh hell, she could just state that ‘she was scared of you and didn’t want to make the situation worse and that’s why she signed the contract….’

    Although, thinking about it…. I thought rape to women was worse than death? So, how does one make such a situation worse? I’m guessing Geraldine Kelly can inform me and the correct thinking one must have in these ‘rape culture’ times.

  68. “My dad is a marriage therapists with 47 years of practice”

    lzozozooz welll dat explainsz the destruction of the family and crucifixion of fatherez and decimation of fatherhoodz and growth of debt zzlzlzoozloozi

    tell us, how does your DADDY feel about the destructcizozn of the family during his tenure and papacy? doth it makez hisbuttgo tizngzgzlzllzziziznzinzlzlizlzlzgznznzgzzzlzllzozlzoz likesz yourz vag? llolllzozozizzizllzlozozo

  69. earl says:

    It seems like in 90-95% of these stories alcohol or some other mind altering drug was involved.

    Perhaps if women would quit getting drunk…this stuff wouldn’t happen.

    There I go victim blaming and assigning responsibility again.

  70. Cautiously Pessimistic says:

    Sure, most women won’t end up divorcing their husbands…

    Well, in the since that when flipping a coin, it doesn’t often come up heads.

  71. Cane Caldo says:

    Ha! An “Armchair Husband” label. Awesome.

  72. wgdupree says:

    Dearest “Know How”,

    1. Your viewpoint is skewed by being raised by a father who obviously bought the feminized fantasy, and whose livelihood depends upon the farce of equality being perpetuated. How did marriage, as defined for thousands of years, survive without marriage counselors?

    2. Feminism was borne in the US in large part as a movement in favor of prohibition. Alcohol was viewed as the root cause of men failing to lead and provide for the family.

    3. You are missing the whole point, not in part, if you perceive that discussions on this site and other game sites are all about a man “enslaving” his wife to a life of servitude and sex. The point of game is to give men a way of improving themselves by understanding the underlying nature of women.

    4. Women, by their very nature and biological makeup, are to some degree feminine. Some to more of a degree than others, but nevertheless, generally, all have a feminine component. Like a caged animal, women who are ensnared by the lie of equality will not ever be fully satisfied with their life.

    5. In any two-party relationship, one party will be dominant. This flies in the face of the argument of equality. Any couple that states that they are equal partners in the relationship necessarily means that the female is the dominant party in that particular relationship. The relationship will most likely not last.

    6. By nature, the masculine seeks to be dominant, to protect and provide for his mate. The reciprocal effect for providence and security is respect for his leadership in the relationship.

    7. I could go on, but this comment is already too long. However, one last point is to consider the state of the family prior to the tipping point of female influence in western society (call it post-WWII), and the state of the family today. Generally speaking, but certainly not in every situation, families were much more stable, as were marriages, children were happier, and people were generally more satisified with their lives.

    I am a married man, not a PUA, and I read game blogs to improve my marriage, and ultimately, I seek to make my wife, as well as myself, more satisfied in our marriage. Swallow the red pill before it is too late.

  73. PuzzledTraveller says:

    Yeah. Good luck with that kid.

    You’re going to equal rights yourself right into a divorce. I’ve never seen a business, military unit or family operate properly when every member was equally in charge. Someone has to be the leader. If you aren’t going to do it, she will, and she won’t like it and you won’t like the result. All the high faluting “we’re 100% equal” crap will vaporize on the ground and in the trenches. Don’t say we didn’t warn you. Nature abhors a power vacuum, and so do dames.

  74. Anchorman says:

    Couple observations after reading 30 or so comments.

    The father has been a therapist for 47 years. He is steeped in Marriage 1.0 and it would be really unimaginable for a therapist that old to mentally break and re-explore the world to see what marriage for the 40 and under crew is and to recognize Marriage 2.0.

    Know How, if your wife begins to misbehave:

    Reckless spending
    Late nights out with girlfriends who bad mouth you
    Mocking you in public
    Refusing sex unless you perform Herculean tasks
    And so on

    Could you change her behavior for the better?

    The answer is important if she has one of the following red flags:

    Bad credit or debt of any size, including the “I only have debt left over from college because I couldn’t get student loans” lie
    Multiple sex partners – each one decreases her ability to mate-bond
    Moxie, “take no crap” attitude or has already started to mock you in public in front of her friends (proving to her friends who is really in charge)
    Broken marriage home life

    Those are some of the flags a man can spot ahead of time. Those aren’t even what she SHOULD BE to qualify for marriage (godly, demure, pure, modest).

    I wish you the best, Know How, but I think you’ve already allowed her to publicly claim superior status in your relationship. If you can’t correct her bad behavior, you invite it.

    Postpone the wedding.

  75. Lmao, did the original writer of that label it, “How to be a whipped dog church husband”? Did he miss high school *and* college, and never learned a thing about women?

  76. earl says:

    With thinking like this…is it any wonder adultery and divorce is so rampant?

    It’s true…the less you impose your will on her…the more she will impose her will on you. There is no such thing as balance.

  77. Legion says:

    wgdupree says: November 14, 2013 at 8:05 am
    Swallow the red pill before it is too late.”

    I think he will need the Blue Pill 2×4 suppository in family court first before he can swallow the Red Pill.
    lollzlolzzlollzz

  78. Jen says:

    Feminist Hater -
    “Avoiding them is the only approach.”

    Might want to expand the definition of “them”….

    In Arlington, Virginia, an Air Force officer was acquitted, on Wednesday, of “groping” a “woman” outside a Virginia bar. The “woman”, a transsexual (which is a very loosely defined term when used by the MSM; the AF guy was drunk according to his lawyer), punched and hit him repeatedly in the face. A bar employee called the police to assist the man who was getting beaten in the face.

    Although acquitted, you know this guy’s Air Force career is over.

  79. Tom H says:

    Clarification: If you are dominant, you do not need to act in a domineering fashion in order to attain dominance. Acting in a domineering fashion will not help you attain dominance.

    Sure, men can be at fault. We probably make a lot more mistakes as a group simply because a much larger percent of us have a social disability. The male culture also has some pathologies, like the teenage boy pathological predator imprinting, which teaches and imprints teenage boys with the notion that girls are their prey. I would say that the female culture also has some pathologies, including some of those from women’s lib, like the ones that pretend that there aren’t distinctive male/female roles and chores.

    Women want men who are dominant, if the women are mentally healthy and not disturbed by unrealistic notions about romantic relationships originating from women’s lib found in academia. Women who are mentally healthy want men who will protect them. The song “Under my thumb” expresses the concept in a hyperbolic way, but fairly accurately.

    Imagine a couple in bed sleeping, awakened by a noise. The woman gets her gun and tells her man to wait there, she’ll go check out the noise. Yes, total fiction. Ain’t gonna happen.

  80. 8to12 says:

    (1) A single man should not be lecturing married men on marriage.

    (2) He should consider that he advice he is giving has been pretty standard fare for a while; I’d wager that most most of the men on this forum agreed with him at one time in their life, and that the majority of adult men currently agree with his position.

    (3) He should ask himself this: if the advice he is giving (and which most men agree with) is so darned good, why is the divorce rate is over 50%?

    (4) I suggest our friend go over to talkaboutmarriage.com and start reading. Read everything on the site.

    (5) After he has submerged himself in the real life consequences of his marriage advice at “talk about marriage” he should revisit #3. I suspect his opinion will be different.

  81. 8oxer says:

    Everybody gets to attain their basic aspirations, so everybody wins. Especially Know How, who gets to man up, step up, and take responsibility. He gets to improve the life of a woman, by financing her goals. We should cherish the crucial role he plays in financing this setup, so that this win-win-win equilibrium is possible.

    You won’t find me bashing him, and for this reason. While he is out busting ass to pay the bills, a better man will educate his slut “wife”. I’m sure she’ll be returned to him “more worthy”…

  82. 8oxer says:

    Does that make sense to you? Seems crazy, doesn’t it? But it is how women think. Part of what she wants is for you to know that you should treat her a certain way, regardless of what she says she wants. Do you ever wonder why women go for a certain type of guy, even though those men are nothing like what they say they want? Do you think it’s an accident? It isn’t. Those men don’t listen to what women tell them they want, they act in the way women like. And they have no shortage of women who want to be with them for that reason.

    This is only partly true.

    Women are attracted to a man with goals and aspirations. It follows that a man with goals and aspirations will not put his woman up on some queenly pedestal.

    Think about it this way: What if some woman spent her every waking hour in your space, invading your bubble… Even if she was kissing your ass and delusionally crowing about how wonderful you were, you’d get sick of it, right? You don’t want someone to make you their priority. If someone did that, you’d think they were unhinged and urge them to get a life.

    In this regard, women aren’t that different from us. If you’re spending all day, every day, kissing your woman’s ass, then she’s going to get sick of you. If you really love her, make her chase you a little bit and give her the thrill of “winning” your affections. Have a career and some hobbies and let her know she’s not your only priority. That’s what works.

    Women who persistently chase abusive men, crackheads and gangbangers are an extreme variety of this, and their issues are best avoided. I’d never suggest to any man that he behave in that way just to attract a woman. The types of women who go for that are screwballs and its beneath his dignity anyway. But, a little bit of indifference and dedication (to something other than her wants and needs) will go a long way toward increasing your attractiveness to normal women.

    Regards, Boxer

  83. 8oxer says:

    A single man should not be lecturing married men on marriage.

    This is so obvious it shouldn’t have to be written, but I hope the original author takes it to heart.

    Neither I nor any other unmarried man knows what works in a marriage, even if we think we’ve read a bunch of touchy-feely books and are schooled in the “theory” of relationships.

    It’s humorous to think that there is a single dude who is here passing his insolent judgment upon all you married bros, expecting to be taken seriously.

  84. earl says:

    “While he is out busting ass to pay the bills, a better man will educate his slut “wife”.”

    Because after all he was working all the time and not doting attention onto her. So she had to find it from some other guy.

  85. 8oxer says:

    Because after all he was working all the time and not doting attention onto her. So she had to find it from some other guy.

    This is why I really hope this guy sticks around. It seems like he could use a lot of help if he is to keep his ass out of the divorce courts, and the brothers here are the ones to give it to him.

    Bear in mind that most of us were mangina feminists at one point. I certainly was. It often takes a few bad breakups (or worse) to school a fella on how the world really works.

  86. Michael says:

    @ John Doe

    Speechless

  87. wfprice says:

    My dad is a marriage therapists with 47 years of practice.

    Marriage therapists have abysmal success rates, if you measure success by salvaging the marriage. That they profit directly from the divorce industry should tell us all we need to know about the profession.

  88. Solomon says:

    Dear Know How:

    You will fail.

    See you on the other side of the meat grinder.

  89. Solomon says:

    @Chris Nystrom-

    “You are not your own; you were bought for a price”

    1 Corinthians 6:19-20

  90. Solomon says:

    Every Christian marriage counselor now spouts egalitarian blue-pill lies.

    Not a one of them teaches male authority and female deference.

    Not. A. One.

    Liars, every one, and business is good. When my marriage counselor (who had been at it over 20 years and boasted thousands of hours of counseling dispensed) encouraged me to double-down and supplicate harder because my wife was not happy so I must not be meeting her needs well… well, that advice ruined me, my family, and my children’s childhood- probably just like Know How’s father is lying to his poor clients and ruining family after family just like mine with unbiblical lies…

    Today’s marriage counselors only tickle the ears, not deliver truth- so I don’t think I’d be bragging about a man who was dishing out obvious lies and ruin to people who genuinely love God and need answers.

    Know How: the destruction coming your way will be absolutely spectacular, and if you survive it you will be a husk of what you once were, and perhaps only then, broken, chagrined, inconsolably grieved, you will be able to accept the truth of scripture when it comes to women.

    Since you have rejected the red-pill wisdom here, this will be your fate.

    Hardened hearts can only be broken…

  91. Eidolon says:

    Solomon:

    I think people sometimes hear things like what you said and think they represent hyperbole. Often manosphere people say things like “your wife will divorce you” or “come back when she cheats on you” and I think it makes some who haven’t yet taken the red pill think that they hate women or fear them. And these statements are exaggerations, of course: my recollection was that around 40% of first marriages end in divorce. If we assume that under 1/6th of women who don’t get divorced will cheat then we still have the majority of marriages involving neither divorce nor cheating (though I don’t know if 1/6th is high or low). If those numbers are in the right ballpark, then in that sense most men marrying for the first time will not experience those extremes.

    What is not hyperbole is that 1) the risk of extreme damage to oneself and one’s children exists; 2) that risk is not small (it’s at least 40% and probably significantly higher if you include cheating and cuckoldry); 3) what can be done to mitigate this risk must, in nearly all cases, be done by the man, first by mate selection and later by his actions; and 4) men are actively discouraged from taking mitigating action.

    While many men don’t know anyone whose wife divorced them frivolously or cheated on them (I don’t), it’s important to understand that ignoring these risks to one’s marriage will not make them go away. Indeed, for those who ignore them the risks are far higher.

    For (perhaps) a majority of men who marry, divorce, cheating, and cuckoldry won’t happen to them. This makes many people feel like these problems are therefore overblown in the manosphere community. However, I don’t think they are.

    Consider AIDS: most people won’t contract it, even if they act very irresponsibly, even if they do nothing to prevent contracting it. On the other hand, the consequences are so dire that only a fool would disregard them. Even those who espouse a philosophy which says that sex is nearly always good and harmless advise people to protect themselves from the possibility of contracting AIDS.

    Yet the manosphere sees a whole culture of men being encouraged to engage in an activity with nearly the same potential to destroy lives (arguably more since it can impact multiple generations), with a far higher risk than the risk of contracting AIDS, and further encouraged to avoid any and all actions which might protect them; indeed, they are actively shamed for considering those actions. If the warnings of the manosphere are excessively hyperbolic, warnings about AIDS are far more ludicrously overblown.

  92. Ton says:

    To be fair most married men don’t know a damn thing about marriage either, besides it’s sucks that is

  93. Lyn87 says:

    If Know How is reading this thread:

    Marriage doesn’t work like you think it does. As others have stated – there is no such thing as equality in a relationship. That’s not to say that two people will disagree often, but it does mean that one of you has veto authority. It cannot be any other way.

    My wife and I have been married for 26 years, and I can count the times we’ve disagreed (other than about trivial stuff) on the fingers of one hand. I can count the number of times we’ve raised our voices to each other in anger on the fingers of one foot (zero). You may be that one-in-ten-thousand couple who clicks like that, but you almost certainly will not be. Let’s assume you won’t because it’s absurd to plan on that, especially since you’ve had your skull filled with nonsense from the cradle… as evidenced by the fact you think that husbands being the heads of their households is slavery, or demeaning, or belittling. It is not – it is how wise husbands lead their families (including their wives).

    You and your soon-to-be-wife will eventually disagree about something that is not trivial. It may be money. It may be kids. It may be a big move. It will be something neither of you wants to budge on and for which there is no compromise. If you are “equals,” who breaks the tie? The one who breaks the ties is the head of the household. If you give in to keep the peace, you abrogate the headship of the family to her. Period. TRUST US – YOU DO NOT WANT TO DO THAT.

    That may keep the peace for a while, but you’re walking blindfolded into a minefield. If you give in to her and it works out well she will consider that proof of her superior leadership, and if it works out poorly she will resent you for not being man enough to stand up to her B.S.. You lose either way. She’s a WOMAN, she needs YOU to be the MAN. That doesn’t mean being a tyrant (see above), but it does mean having the frame of authority. Authority and responsibility go hand-in-hand. She may like the authority for a while, but she will resent having to shoulder the responsibility – your responsibility – eventually. If she has veto authority, she will begin to feel the power of that authority and the weight of that responsibility, and you’ll become just another one of the children. (Wives thinking of their husbands as big kids is so common that it’s a staple of entertainment and commercials. Don’t be that guy.)

    By all means, discuss things. Listen to her when making plans and decisions – I assume you wouldn’t be marrying her if you thought she was incapable of making good decisions most of the time If she has a better idea than you, demonstrate enough security to admit that her idea is better (but only if it really is better)…

    … This next bit is really freaking important: then YOU make the decision FOR THE FAMILY to do it the way YOU determine is the best… but while it may be her suggestion, it is your decision. And she needs to know that it’s your decision. And if she cannot convince you that her way is better, then YOU make the decision to do it a different way, and she gets over it and submits to the authority of you: her husband.

    You need to have this as a clear understanding before you walk down the aisle with this woman. If she is unwilling to acknowledge you as the head of the household (the one who has the veto power, whether or not you ever even have to use it), then you are setting yourself up for a world of hurt. Even wives who spout egalitarian nonsense need that from their husbands – give it to her or pay the price. If you won’t be her MAN, there’s more than a passing chance that someone else will be, especially if she’s attractive. And even if she doesn’t go all the way down that road, your wife and your life will be much happier if you wear the pants and she knows it. Again, authority and responsibility go hand-in-hand, and if you are “equal” (LOL… seriously… LOL) in authority, then she will feel both the weight and the power of that authority. That’s not a game you want to lose, and it’s not a game you should even try to play.

  94. Manlyman says:

    On a related note… it appears that Mr. Athol Kay is on the verge of closing the “Relationship 911″ portion of his forum because too many people are calling women on their shit. Of course, that would hurt The Cult of Athol’s cash flow.

    Thou shalt not offend women.
    Carry on.

  95. Eliezer Ben-Yehuda says:

    >> While many men don’t know anyone whose wife divorced them frivolously or cheated on them

    Ignorance is bliss. On average, women are better liars than men are detectives.

  96. Lyn87,

    I would very much like to nominate that post of yours as post of the year, nope post of the millenium.

  97. MarcusD says:

    @TFH

    It’s basically an equation involving percentage of total words that are part of a set of certain words that feminists seem to use a lot. It’s a little more complicated than that (it involves DFAs and data-mining), but that’s the gist of it.

  98. Oblivion says:

    @lyn87

    that post was epic :)

  99. earl says:

    “Thou shalt not offend women.”

    Which number is this on Satan’s ten commandments?

  100. earl says:

    @Lyn87

    That’s probably better advice than his marriage therapist dad ever spouted.

  101. mrsdarlings says:

    Wait until he gets married and has kids. It’s the same thing my father said 49 years + ago. He is now twiced divorced by both women. This also failed me in my pre marriage relationships and attraction to them. It’s not about me is total b.s and false hero-ism to sound great and glorious. Again he’s not married. Speaks for itself. At least he has an attitude of progression. I’m seeing this to much in the you haters and it’s failing them. Of course the men should not be rude and condescending. But a woman has a designated role and position and of course needs to be chosen VOLUNTARILY. Until she lives in her proper place and designated design she will look DOWN on her husband and use him for her designs. Women cannot creat long lasting results because they are to present in THE NOW. Everything RIGHT NOW. And consistency is KING for any success. What he says is inexperienced rubbish.

  102. mrsdarlings says:

    A women can only be consistent if she LOOKS UP TO AND SEXUALLY DESIROUS FOR HER HUSBAND. This reeks of beta philosophy

  103. mrsdarlings says:

    *im seeing this too much in the youth. predictive text, sorry

  104. @Solomon Exactly. Excellent verse. If you attack Christian marriage you are really attacking the core of the Christian faith.

  105. Luke says:

    SLwerner says:
    November 13, 2013 at 4:32 pm
    “Tom H – ”The fact is, college-educated women have lower fertility rates than those who aren’t.”
    You seem to be conflating fertility (as evidence by birthing children) with an antonym expressed as infertility; which is more commonly used to describe a medical condition .

    Being childless does not necessarily mean that a woman was infertile, but rather that her fertility was never brought to fruition. I believe that the proper antonym of fertility would be childlessness.”

    The sought-for missing term I suggest is fecundity. College-educated women are less fecund than non-college-going women in this country. (It means successful at bearing children.)

  106. Fred Flange says:

    @Manlyman
    The point of Athol’s site is to talk sh*t about what’s wrong with your marriage, with the goal towards healing it or deciding to GTFO. Not victim puking. The problem there apparently was too much of the latter for its own sake. And he’s the first to admit it’s for his cash flow now that the site is his full time gig. Besides it’s his turf, his rules, right?

  107. Michael says:

    @ Lyn87

    That post was very good. Except I got scared at the end when you said:

    “That’s not a game you want to lose, and it’s not a game you should even try to play.”

    Should I even get married? Can I take the position Lyn87 mapped out as head of the household?

    That’s a very good post Lyn87. It’s making me see things a little clearer. Assuming a guy can master this post before walking down the aisle perfectly in every way you mentioned what happens when it gets to the point where she won’t budge and keeps nagging to get her way. Will she resent you and keep it up? Or automatically default to a first officer position (the rank below captain but still in charge of the ship) when that moment comes regarding a decision BOTH are unwilling to budge on?

  108. Michael says:

    @ lyn87

    Thinking in terms of male responsibility and manning up –

    I would also assume that when such a point comes in the marriage that if both parties are unwilling to budge on a decision and the Husband rejects what the wife wants and asserts his position as head of the household then FAILS BIG TIME – Say perhaps a situation where the husband wanted to invest in something (assets, stocks etc) and the wife disagreed and refused to budge but eventually yielded to him as head of the household – it would be a devastating blow.. it would be curtains for Mr. Husband.

  109. Mikediver says:

    Deciding and going your way and failing is not a disaster. If you expect to go through life never being wrong or making no mistakes then you are going to be disappointed often. Women get more satisfaction from being proven right than from success in any endevour. However, If you go the other way and let her rule the roost, win or lose, you lose. She will see you as weak and unable to provide and protect her. She will no longer need you and start looking for a man to take care of her. That is the nature of women.

    You need to be able to own the failure and then go on. You will learn and fail less over time, but letting the woman make the decisions will just lead to divorce court where no man wins ever.

  110. Anonymous Reader says:

    Michael
    I would also assume

    Based on what premises? Examine your premises and see if they are true or not – for example, are you assuming, perhaps unconsciously, that men and women are interchangeable, identical in essence, and therefore should be equals in a marriage? If so, read more of this site and every site on Dalrocks sidebar.

    If not, then why are you making this assumption?

  111. Random Angeleno says:

    @Michael, it’s like this:
    Let her make the final decision and you will ALWAYS come out on the short end whether she is right or wrong.
    You making the final decision at least helps you to remain in charge and keep her respect. Yes no one is perfect hence all life is risk. Sure you risk being wrong: know it, own it, step up to it. Any other way is to cede her the high ground and no good will ever come out of that.

  112. Anonymous age 71 says:

    My best friend in the US told me in the 60′s he was working at Boeing in Kansas. He thought he was dating the woman he wanted to marry, but he was nervous because his parents had a really bad divorce.

    He asked a wise, old black man he worked with how he could tell if she was the right woman.

    The wise old man told him, “It’s easy. Just disagree with her.”

    He asked, “What do you mean?”

    The wise old man said, “You young, horny guys will do anything you are told to keep the sex flowing. If she tells you to jump off a cliff or else get cut off, you jump. Disagree with her on something, and stick to it no matter how much she screams and threatens, and you will find out what marriage will be like, because in marriage sooner or later you MUST disagree with her on something. Pick something that is not even her business, like which shirt you are wearing, and refuse to change, and don’t give up no matter what she threatens.”

    Three days later was the last time he ever saw her. Heh, heh.

    He did not marry until well into the 80′s, and he was in his 50′s. Still married.

  113. Lyn87 says:

    Michael asks:

    Should I even get married? Can I take the position Lyn87 mapped out as head of the household?

    That’s a very good post Lyn87. It’s making me see things a little clearer. Assuming a guy can master this post before walking down the aisle perfectly in every way you mentioned what happens when it gets to the point where she won’t budge and keeps nagging to get her way. Will she resent you and keep it up? Or automatically default to a first officer position (the rank below captain but still in charge of the ship) when that moment comes regarding a decision BOTH are unwilling to budge on?

    I’ll try to answer these one at a time.

    Should I even get married? I can’t answer that for anyone but myself. I can say that, “It is better to marry than to burn.” Since the only moral alternative to marriage is permanent celibacy, there is both tremendous risk and tremendous opportunity cost.

    Can I take the position Lyn87 mapped out as head of the household? I did. Many others have. Many others have not. I’ll be the first to admit that I married a unicorn, though. I won’t describe my wife, as many here would simply not believe that it is possible for one woman to possess that group of attributes, but I will say that she was a VERY good catch. I’ll also say this, though: if you’re NOT the head of the house, your risk goes WAY up. If a women isn’t clear about accepting (even wanting) your headship, the risk increases. If she actually spouts “equality” crap, I would advise a quick exit, although she might just be parroting stuff she’s heard and may still be salvageable.

    Assuming a guy can master this post before walking down the aisle perfectly in every way you mentioned what happens when it gets to the point where she won’t budge and keeps nagging to get her way. Will she resent you and keep it up? Or automatically default to a first officer position (the rank below captain but still in charge of the ship) when that moment comes regarding a decision BOTH are unwilling to budge on? That”s why it’s SO VERY IMPORTANT to be clear about lines of authority before marriage… before engagement even. Make her qualify herself (her willingness to submit to the authority of a husband) to you before you put a ring on it, including an engagement ring. (After a while her submissiveness to your authority should come pretty naturally to her.) A woman who has bought into the “marriage of equals” mindset is not prepared for Christian matrimony, because she is not prepared to submit to the authority of her husband. If she has thoroughly internalized wifely submission, she won’t nag until she gets her way (unless the husband is so weak that he folds at the slightest resistance). My wife backs down when I tell her that my mind is made up. There is no nagging. If she did nag, I would just tell her to stop it. She already knows nagging is bad – duh. Some wives may resent not getting their way for a while, and they may carry the grudge for a long time, but in any case that’s preferable to ceding headship to them. In the long run, her anger over being over-ruled is trivial compared to what she will feel if you back down to keep the peace.

    You may make mistakes and choose poorly sometimes. Having said that, I never make a decision of any import without talking to my wife about it. 99.99% of the time we’re in consensus, and I always explain my rationale. I CAN decide on my own, but I WANT her buy-in. She’s a smart girl (she married me, didn’t she?), and her ideas often sharpen mine and inform my decisions. But you have to own it when you decide poorly. Weaseling out and making excuses is pathetic, even if you changed your mind based on her counsel. That’s part-and-parcel of having the authority of being the husband… you also have the responsibility that comes with the authority.

  114. Pingback: Pure Genius | A Northern Observer

  115. A Northern Observer says:

    Anonymous age 71 says: November 15, 2013 at 10:06 pm

    That’s pure genius dude! So simple, yet so profound.

  116. Ri Ri says:

    The wise old man said, “You young, horny guys will do anything you are told to keep the sex flowing. If she tells you to jump off a cliff or else get cut off, you jump. Disagree with her on something, and stick to it no matter how much she screams and threatens, and you will find out what marriage will be like, because in marriage sooner or later you MUST disagree with her on something. Pick something that is not even her business, like which shirt you are wearing, and refuse to change, and don’t give up no matter what she threatens.”

    Strange. My husband and I have never fought. We’ve been together almost 10 years.

    I can’t imagine disagreeing with him over something as simple as a shirt. Who cares about shirts?

  117. My husband and I have never fought. We’ve been together almost 10 years.

    Something’s very wrong then – no two people can be together that long and not have a fight. Most likely there’s a heavy conflict-avoidance element going on here.

  118. Ri Ri says:

    No. We’ve just never had anything to argue about. We are on the same page about all major issues in life. We are very similar in our natures and character.

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