The Three Lazy Ones

I haven’t done a Brothers Grimm post in a while, and I don’t have time today to write up some of the other posts I have in mind.  Today’s tale is The Three Lazy Ones.  Enjoy.

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44 Responses to The Three Lazy Ones

  1. greenlander says:

    And the fourth (who happened to be named “Greenlander”) said, “Father, thy kingdom will be mine, for I am so lazy that as your empire is collapsing, I’ll just sit in my castle and screw shameless feminist hos and drink wine, and when I am through with them I shall cast both the skanks and empty bottles aside. And I shall not do anything to restore property rights, or give incentivize good behavior, or suppress hypergamy throughout thy former kingdom. And when the peasants finally revolt, they shall put my lazy head at the end of a sharp pike and display it for all to see. And that won’t bother me, for I will have enjoyed a debaucherous life of sloth and game.”

  2. krakonos says:

    @Greenlander
    And I just wondered why our kingdom is dissolving so fast. I would hail to you, but I am too lazy :)

  3. Opus says:

    That’s the trouble with these (lazy) Europeans; none of this ever happens provided you (as we do) have Primogenitur. ;)

  4. Butterfly Flower says:

    Can you please do a post on “The Fox and the Grapes”?

    I feel like your Beta readers need to learn a lesson on cognitive dissonance.

    Just because Betas frequently get screwed over by carousel riding whores, doesn’t mean all women are carousel riding whores that deserve to be treated poorly.

    Read what CSPB told me on your first “Last One Down the Isle” post:

    The man you want is the prize. If you expect him to woo you as if you are the prize, then it may not work out well. That day is gone and the best young men know that. It would be much more productive to concentrate on the things that would make you a good wife that go beyond your faith, your beauty and your virginity, rather than dwell on the things that a man should do to prove himself to you

    CSPB told me my chastity, faithfulness, and beauty are irrelevant traits. I need to treat men like the prize; I have a vagina so I’m a worthless lesser being. The only thing of value I can bring into a relationship is money. [I assume CSPB meant money when he said "what else do you have to offer?"]

    Literally, his statement convinced me Betas aren’t worthy of dating. After reading that one paragraph, my opinion of Betas quickly entered the “they’re damaged evil bastards” catagory.

    The more I read the manosphere [it's been three weeks now], the more I encounter whiny Beta cognitive dissonance.

    I think someone respected like you should call Betas out on their damaged thought-pattern.

    It’s scaring away good girls and possibly sending them into the arms of Alphas. [The more the Betas were mean to me, the better that Steve Johnson Alpha looked]. Or making good girls consider taking up religious vows of chastity. Heck, I’d reconsider my sexuality before I’d spend one second thinking about dating a Beta!

  5. Kai says:

    Because betas got screwed over by a bunch of women, they shouldn’t think all women are worthless.

    …But because some betas you’ve heard from here have not respected you, you believe that all betas everywhere will not respect you and don’t deserve you?

    Maybe have another think about that cognitive dissonance…

  6. Butterfly Flower says:

    …But because some betas you’ve heard from here have not respected you, you believe that all betas everywhere will not respect you and don’t deserve you?

    Well, no Beta stood up for me. No one called out CSPB out for being a jerk.

    In fact, most of the readers agreed with CSPB; I’m a worthless twit that deserves to be treated badly by Betas because I have a vagina. Even some of the women readers agreed with his opinion! Hope was especially cruel to me. The first thing she told me was “Go leave the mansophere, you socialite!”

    Doomed Harlot and Steve Johnson were the only readers here capable of conversing with me without trying to paint me as some sort-of conniving scheming evil jezebel troll.

    An Alpha and a “Harlot” were the only people here that seemed like decent stable individuals that I’d enjoy talking to.

    I’m not sure if that’s ironic or sad.

  7. jack says:

    Butterfly flower-

    Cognitive dissonance and grapes are thine:

    Betas driving you into the arms of an alpha? No. If you could get an alpha, you would not be considering or even noticing betas. You would already have an alpha.

    Not all women are carousel riding whores? I think that is an obvious truth.

    But you neglect to consider another group of women – a much larger group in fact – the carousel admirers.

    These are the non-slutty women that did not ride the carousel, but spent most every waking moment carefully watching the carousel in hopes of snagging an alpha in between carousel riders.

    These women are the ones who may have a low number, but still acted dismissively and haughtily toward good, solid guys.

    They are not functionally different than slutty girls since they are every bit as entitlement minded as the trampy girls.

    Having a particular class of women ignore you for years then suddenly find you attractive is very suspicious to men who are paying attention. In other words, these women have established their reputation as ones who TRIED to secure and alpha, and failed, and are now willing to give it a shot with a beta provider.

    The net result of that will be a seven year marriage, followed by an Eat/Pray/Love divorce.

    Once a girl has made such a large emotional and psychological investment in snagging a high-status guy, reality can only provide disappointment.

    I intend to prevent myself from becoming some girl’s “biggest mistake”.

  8. Doomed Harlot says:

    Butterfly,

    Thanks for saying nice things about me. You can’t judge all so-called “betas” based on the people you talk to in the Man-o-sphere. Betas in the manosphere do tend to be whiney, disgruntled, and hostile towards women (sorry guys, but, c’mon, you know it’s true). But only a tiny percentage of men participate in the Man-o-sphere. There are plenty of great guys who don’t harbor these attitudes.

    The area where I take issue with you, Butterfly, is that I think you harbor the same attitudes as they do. You’re saying that there are cock-carousel sluts out there who DESERVE to be treated badly because somehow they screwed over the betas. You are validating the anti-woman beliefs these guys hold.

    A woman who chooses to sleep with some men but not others is NOT screwing over the men she is not sleeping with. A desirable woman does not have some moral obligation to sleep with everyone equally, any more than is a desirable man. No one is entitled to sex.

  9. Anonymous says:

    Tales of horror from Marriage 2.0…

    http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/24732-hiv-positive.html

    (Faithful hubby finds out wife’s cheating ’cause doc finds he’s got AIDS.)

    Oldie but goodie…

    http://www.askugg.com/2007/04/05/i-lied-to-and-cheated-on-my-husband-for

    -14-years-so-he-could-provide-for-me-5-of-our-7-children-were-not-his-an
    d-now-im-leaving-him-for-the-other-man/
    (Like it says.)

  10. Svar says:

    @ Greenlander

    hahaha

  11. Butterfly Flower says:

    Betas driving you into the arms of an alpha? No. If you could get an alpha, you would not be considering or even noticing betas. You would already have an alpha.

    WHAT. THE. F^CK.

    Do all Betas think like this?

    Now that is definitely cognitive dissonance, my dear.

    I’m a beautiful young woman that gets hit on by Alphas; I find their flirting insincere and I generally ignore them. I’m afraid they’re just trying to use me for sex. I deserve better than a man that only thinks I’m just a pretty face.

    I flirt with shy “Beta” types, but they never respond well. They either ignore me or refuse to open up. I assume they’re not interested in me and I get discouraged from ever flirting with them again.

    Heck, I asked about that in one of my first posts in the manosphere! Why do sad looking Betas refuse to flirt back with me?

    Now I know why.

    They all think I’m an evil slutty conniving whore.

    I don’t want an Alpha for the sake of wanting an Alpha, I just want to marry a man that will treat me well. I don’t want to be with a man that’s convinced I’ll leave him and commit infidelity!

    I think I’ll reconsider bisexuality. I’m Catholic and I like men, but I mean, I could picture myself settling for a nice girl and having a stable happy relationship.

    Obviously there’s some deeper issue concerning my attraction to men. I mean, I personally can’t see myself getting treated like a whore, or allow myself to be compared to all of the misgivings of carousel riders. If that’s the norm, then I guess I’m not as heterosexual as I’d should be. I mean, the whole concept of dating a man these days sounds seriously wrong to me. I’m honestly confused in a way that makes the back of my throat burn. I want to avoid men because I’m afraid they might hurt me. I never had a boyfriend before because I was shy in High School and only jerky Alphas pursued me. When I’d flat-out turn them down other girls would tease me and accuse me of being a lesbian. Maybe there was some truth in their accusations?

    Maybe I’m not like most women when it comes to relationships with men and struggle with understanding all of this manosphere stuff because I’m not entirely interested in men?

  12. Svar says:

    @ Butterfly Flower

    The betas here aren’t the same as the betas elsewhere. The betas here may treat you poorly(mainly because they think you are a troll; I have my suspicions but I’m going to assume that you’re genuine), the alphas here IRL will pump and dump you. The lesser betas IRL will be awkward towards you but the greater beta-types are the kind of guys you should aim for(or a lesser alpha if you’re hot enough).

    Btw, are you a Christian by chance? Regardless of your faith, go ask either Paige or Alte for advice. They’re women, they can help you out with this better than I can.

  13. Svar says:

    @ Butterfly Flower

    Nope, not wanting to be treated like a whore doesn’t mean you’re gay. BTW, one reason why no one probably came to your defense is because around here, coming to the defense of a girl will get your branded a white knight. I might get pounded for taking your side(you seem genuine to me now).

  14. Butterfly Flower says:

    Thanks for saying nice things about me. You can’t judge all so-called “betas” based on the people you talk to in the Man-o-sphere. Betas in the manosphere do tend to be whiney, disgruntled, and hostile towards women (sorry guys, but, c’mon, you know it’s true). But only a tiny percentage of men participate in the Man-o-sphere. There are plenty of great guys who don’t harbor these attitudes.

    But where will I find these great guys? I’m not looking for Prince Charming, I have realistic expectations. I just don’t want to get hurt or mistreated. I’m afraid men will emotionally scar me.

    The area where I take issue with you, Butterfly, is that I think you harbor the same attitudes as they do. You’re saying that there are cock-carousel sluts out there who DESERVE to be treated badly because somehow they screwed over the betas. You are validating the anti-woman beliefs these guys hold.

    A woman who chooses to sleep with some men but not others is NOT screwing over the men she is not sleeping with. A desirable woman does not have some moral obligation to sleep with everyone equally, any more than is a desirable man. No one is entitled to sex.

    I’m a judgmental ‘lil brat; my attitude is a bit immature. I guess you’re right, I probably should tone down my calling out on other women. Their choices are their own choices.

    …what I don’t get is why so many Betas think they’re entitled to good girls, but when a pretty good girl like me tries to interact with a Beta, they scare me off.

  15. Butterfly Flower, you sound different from before. I have my doubts about you too. But let me say that there are some “alphas” who are religious and would value a pretty virgin. Not all “betas” are nice guys, and not all alphas are “jerks”, as Americans say.

  16. Bob says:

    @ Dalrock’s original post:

    OK, I give up, I have no idea what this story is supposed to mean, or what message is being sent. Granted, a bunch of Grimm stories are just “scare ‘em straight” tales for the kids, but I think I’m too literal-minded to get this one.

    @ Butterfly:

    On the manosphere, part of the hate comes from the belief that any woman too good to be true probably is. Hence, accusations of being a troll, sock puppet, or other type of faker. I’m harboring doubts myself, but I’ll take you at face value for the time being.

    The other part of it is that manosphere betas (myself included) a well aware of how often women see us as accessories, just in different ways. We may be ego-boosting beta orbiters from the carousel riders. Or we may be the tool who takes care of traditional women while they do essentially nothing. We’re wary of that. Most of us have been taken advantage of, and it’s twice as hard to deal with when the woman genuinely doesn’t see that what she’s doing sounds exactly like that.

    So when you genuinely wonder why you can’t find a decent man – well, to an ordinary listener, it’s indistinguishable from the whining of women who turn down plenty of decent men because they aren’t Alphas. When you genuinely offer valued traits like youth, beauty and virginity, i’s indistinguishable from the cries of “I have a vagina, why isn’t life perfect?” When you say you want a man, it’s indistinguishable from the demands of women who want a man as an accessory to their life, like a handbag or McMansion.

    Your legitimate problems, in short, sound just like the empty complaints of many, many women who have scorned and hurt beta men throughout their lives – even if you’re trying to be good and do everything right. Manosphere men are better at spotting and describing it, but every beta in real life knows the feeling of being less than a thing to women. Not just carousel riders, either, but the observers and opporuntists mentioned earlier.

    Add that to the fact that so many men grew up believing the way to a girl’s heart was to be nice to her, and being unable to pin that lie on any particular person, and you’re facing an uphill battle.

    You can differentiate yourself from them, though. Best way to do it is to actively engage the decent men out there. I know you want to be chased, but you’re dealing with some gun-shy men out there. Find a decent-seeming guy you can admire, and ask him out for coffee (or something similarly tame). Go slow, so he’ll eventually believe you’re not fresh off the carousel; if he’s as decent as he seems, he’ll put up with the wait. Once he knows he’s not wasting his time, he’ll start chasing you the way you want. But it takes effort and patience.

  17. jso says:

    “Just because Betas frequently get screwed over by carousel riding whores, doesn’t mean all women are carousel riding whores that deserve to be treated poorly.”

    I’m honestly trying to be open minded, but maybe you shouldn’t open your argument with a code red shaming tactic

    maybe instead of putting the burden on the man for having been stung before, you could try a little warmth and kindness

  18. Butterfly Flower says:

    Nope, not wanting to be treated like a whore doesn’t mean you’re gay.

    Well, not gay. I said I might be bisexual. I think it’s a real possibility I should look into. I’m not really attracted to men all that much. I mean, I’m attracted to men, I’m just not automatically attracted to Alphas. When Alphas flirt with me, I get annoyed. Betas don’t really seem like my cup of tea either. I thought I liked shy quiet guys, but I’m not so sure anymore. So if I wouldn’t be happy in a relationship with an Alpha or a Beta, then maybe I’d be happier with a girl? I care about my own happiness and if that’s the only type of relationship I would be happy in, then I should explore that option.

    BTW, one reason why no one probably came to your defense is because around here, coming to the defense of a girl will get your branded a white knight. I might get pounded for taking your side(you seem genuine to me now).

    …so Betas frown upon standing up for women???

    On the manosphere, part of the hate comes from the belief that any woman too good to be true probably is. Hence, accusations of being a troll, sock puppet, or other type of faker. I’m harboring doubts myself, but I’ll take you at face value for the time being.

    That’s kind-of flattering. I’m so awesome I sound too good to be true! I need to make a blog to prove I’m real. I can scan my diary! It’s really awesome….

    You can differentiate yourself from them, though. Best way to do it is to actively engage the decent men out there. I know you want to be chased, but you’re dealing with some gun-shy men out there. Find a decent-seeming guy you can admire, and ask him out for coffee (or something similarly tame). Go slow, so he’ll eventually believe you’re not fresh off the carousel; if he’s as decent as he seems, he’ll put up with the wait. Once he knows he’s not wasting his time, he’ll start chasing you the way you want. But it takes effort and patience.

    Honestly, all that advice about Betas sounds really complicated and a big turn off to me. If a man doesn’t like me all that much, then I’d rather not waste my time with him. I understand not everyone will like me, I can deal. If a Beta just doesn’t like me, I wouldn’t want him to waste his time. We both could be happier elsewhere.

  19. Paige says:

    Butterfly,
    I think you are very misguided if you think a lesbian relationship is more stable than a heterosexual relationship. The statistics don’t support this.

    Back when I was young I didn’t struggle to find men who I liked and that liked me back and I am by no means hot or beautiful. I am as average as average gets and yet I have had good men pursue me and then treat me very well. (I have also had men not treat me well but it didn’t leave deep emotional scars…I just moved on).

    I really don’t understand where all your angst is coming from. If I can get guys being average-looking and nice then I can’t fathom why someone who is pretty and nice would have any trouble.

  20. Kai says:

    “Butterfly Flower says:
    …But because some betas you’ve heard from here have not respected you, you believe that all betas everywhere will not respect you and don’t deserve you?
    Well, no Beta stood up for me. No one called out CSPB out for being a jerk.”

    Perhaps no woman in any of their lives ever was anything but a conniving bitch. My point is that you did EXACTLY what you accused them of doing – used your limited sample to label all people in the class. I just can’t believe you can write about cognitive dissonance, and miss so spectacularly.

    Honestly, you come off as entitled. Differently, but equally. “I’m awesome! Why has no man proposed to me yet?!” Even if you are awesome, these things take time. Not all the guys interested in ANY girl will be interesting to her. Most people, at 19, have not yet found someone incredible. As I’ve said before, GIVE IT TIME. 19-year-olds, on average, are not great life partners. But many of them mature into good ones. When I was nineteen, I had no interest in seeking a man, but I had the same problem just trying to find friends – everyone my age was into frivolous things that I found dumb, and the people who were older, more mature, and interesting to me, tended to not take me seriously. It’s a sucky place to be. But if you keep trying, allow some time to prove yourself, and don’t reinforce stereotypes, you start to be taken seriously by the people you want. And in time, you also get a little older and easier to take seriously.

    What’s the rush? You don’t expire at 21. Just keep living, do things that interest you and that will be helpful to you later on in anything you might want to do in life, and give guys a chance to show their decency – even if it might take them a couple years to get there.

  21. tspoon says:

    yeah those betas sure do whinge a lot don’t they – coming in here, hijacking a totally unrelated thread to bellyache about something that happened to them. curse those betas…

  22. Butterfly Flower says:

    I think you are very misguided if you think a lesbian relationship is more stable than a heterosexual relationship. The statistics don’t support this.

    I didn’t say it would be more stable, I just said I might personally be happier in a relationship with another woman. Although I guess it would be more stable for me because I’d be happier and feel more comfortable investing in the relationship.

    Back when I was young I didn’t struggle to find men who I liked and that liked me back and I am by no means hot or beautiful. I am as average as average gets and yet I have had good men pursue me and then treat me very well. (I have also had men not treat me well but it didn’t leave deep emotional scars…I just moved on).

    I really don’t understand where all your angst is coming from. If I can get guys being average-looking and nice then I can’t fathom why someone who is pretty and nice would have any trouble.

    I can find men that like me. But I’m not sure if they’d treat me well. Only Alphas really have the balls to flirt with me, and when I try to flirt with Betas they act all weird and I assume they’re just disinterested.

    yeah those betas sure do whinge a lot don’t they – coming in here, hijacking a totally unrelated thread to bellyache about something that happened to them. curse those betas…

    I just wanted to talk about the Aesop tale Fox and the Grapes; damaged Betas using cognitive dissonance thought patterns and scaring away good women.

    Sorry to go off topic, though *pouts*

    Perhaps no woman in any of their lives ever was anything but a conniving bitch. My point is that you did EXACTLY what you accused them of doing – used your limited sample to label all people in the class. I just can’t believe you can write about cognitive dissonance, and miss so spectacularly.

    Yeah, but I didn’t generalize the Betas. None of the Betas stood up for me, so I just assumed they all agreed with CSPB. The comments that followed CSPB certainly agreed with him.

    If Betas unanimously agree that chastity, faithfulness, and beauty are irrelevant traits – then they have no right to complain about women! The manosphere is pointless.

    Good girls exist, and they deserve better than damaged goods! [Or in my case, another woman. I think I'll experiment and see where that leads. I'm young, I deserve to be happy. I'm honest enough with myself to realize men aren't going to make me happy]

  23. Bob says:

    Actually, I think I see the problem now.

    “None of the Betas stood up for me, so I just assumed they all agreed with CSPB.”

    Why, now, should any man, or any woman, stand up for you in a comment section? Sure, if you’re dating a guy and someone is getting in your space or being threatening, you have every right to expect the guy to step in and at least imply a threat. Granted, I can only back up that “right” with the traditionalism I’m still not quite willing to shake, but let’s take it as a given for now.

    Why should anyone defend the point you’re trying to make on anonymous blogs? Defend your own opinion. Make a rational point in the face of irrational arguments. Be the intellectual equal of those around you. If you expect male strangers to step up and make you case for you, you’ve got a lot to learn.

    More importantly, what if the men on that thread saw the exchange and just didn’t care? They didn’t agree, or disagree, they just were completely apathetic about it? Or what if they wanted to see whether you were capable of mounting a credible defense of your statements before helping? What if they assumed you were a troll?

    There are times and places where needed help is acceptable, or even attractive (triggers those protective instincts). Then there are times when needing help is a sign of serious issues, and feeling entitled to help even worse.

    Take this thread, for instance. You’re getting a fair number of people telling you to stop blowing your problems out of proportion and whining about them, with varying levels of politeness. Your response has not been to refute the nearly unanimous response, but to continue trying to rationalize why all betas must be bad people, or why you deserve what you’re not getting for some reason. What man would defend that position? Consider yourself lucky that most guys would still physically defend you if they happened to be dating you (or perhaps even if they weren’t), and take responsibility for defending your own opinions.

  24. Kathy says:

    Look, I said that I wasn’t coming back.. But, out of curiosity I followed a link from Badgers’s blog..

    Give BF the flick!
    As David Collard said:
    “I have my doubts about you too. ”

    She is a troll.

    This rubbish from her.

    “I didn’t say it would be more stable, I just said I might personally be happier in a relationship with another woman. ”

    After trashing Betas and making out she is such a good Catholic.. (ROLLS EYES)

    So pure.. A paragon of virtue… Too good for most men.. PFFT!

    She is not consistent, Nor is she a good Catholic..

    This:

    “I said I might be bisexual. I think it’s a real possibility I should look into. I’m not really attracted to men all that much.”

    Don’t get sucked in by her games.. She is not genuine.. Just a troll.

    A good CATHOLIC (which is what she purports to be) would not casually admit to a bi sexual attraction on a blog.

    There would be much soul searching anguish and introspection..

    Instead , ditzy flippant comments from BF.

  25. Kathy says:

    “Good girls exist, and they deserve better than damaged goods! [Or in my case, another woman. I think I'll experiment and see where that leads. I'm young, I deserve to be happy. I'm honest enough with myself to realize men aren't going to make me happy]”

    Good girl??? In a pigs eye! (remember she said that she was a good Catholic- homosexuality is a sin then.. nary a mention of that from the good Catholic..! lol.. )
    Please do not get sucked in by this shit.
    Can you not see the inconsistencies here?

    She’s trolling alright!

  26. Paige says:

    So if there are guys who like you then why don’t you just go out with them once or twice to see if something develops? Why all the pre-qualifying?

    I didn’t feel a huge initial attraction for all the guys I dated. In fact, the guy I ended up marrying wasn’t even my type but we went out together as friends and on the first date a spark ignited. He isn’t strictly alpha though he has some alpha-ish qualities. I really don’t know many guys who are strictly alpha/betas…most are a mix of both.

    It seems to me that you are just waaay over-thinking this. Dating should be fun. It shouldn’t provoke so much anxiety. If you like the guy well enough you go out again. If he does something on the first date to creep you out or give off red flags then don’t date them again. If after the third date there is still no spark that is when it is time to quit dating so you don’t lead a decent man on.

    The mistakes I see many women make is that if they don’t feel tingles the second they lay eyes on a guy then they don’t bother dating them. Unlike male attraction female attraction isn’t triggered solely by looks so giving a bit of time to know the guy is usually required. In my experience only about 5% of the population of men can make me feel tingles at first sight. And if they make me tingle they probably make every other girl tingle too…and I don’t have that much interest in dating the guy all the other girls want. I am jealous enough so dating the alpha stud would send me into a tail-spin of anxiety. No thanks.

    You mention flirting but not every decent guy is a good flirt or even able to recognize indicators of interest. It doesn’t mean they are “worthless betas”..it just means they are a bit obtuse in some areas.

    Regarding CSPB’s comment I really don’t see it as THAT horrendous. I didn’t think he was telling you to allow yourself to be treated like a whore. There is a giant distinction between being treated like a princess and being treated like a worthless pump-n-dump. I think you have set up a false dichotomy here. I interpret what he is saying to mean that when you are on a date don’t act like the Ice Queen. If you are into the guy give some indicators of interest. Be nice..sweet…kind…complimentary. Of course you don’t gravel at his feet and beg him to love you.

    The courting stage of relationships in this day and age (where men aren’t desperate to get married because milk is free) there is more give-and-take than before. It isn’t the woman on the pedestal and the man begging for her love. You are both trying to qualify each other for compatibility. Beauty and virginity does not guarantee you both are compatible. Some men pass over women with a high SMV for women who are lower but more compatible. For instance- I am not the prettiest woman my husband has dated. He has dated beautiful women but he fell for me because he felt we were compatible.

    I would recommend watching the tv show Millionaire Matchmaker. It is interesting to see that men who are extremely wealthy and handsome often don’t pick women that are the most objectively beautiful. They go on the show because they are looking for someone worth marrying and those qualifiers are a lot more personal and individual than the qualifiers to be worthy of casual sex. Likewise, some of the rich women looking for love find that they have to bring their standards down a bit and stop being so entitled. Men want a woman that is warm and kind and many of these women are gorgeous but very cold towards the men they date.

  27. My Name Is Jim says:

    Dalrock,

    Do you know how I could send email to Solomon II? I have a question that I think he would be totally the best position to help answer. Solomon, if you’re reading this, drop me an email to yahoo, user name jim428571.

  28. Svar says:

    @ Butterfly Flower

    “If Betas unanimously agree that chastity, faithfulness, and beauty are irrelevant traits ”

    I don’t see where you are getting that from. Those are ideal traits. It’s just people think that you are a troll and that you aren’t being. I, myself am really confused and am not sure. Maybe, you are. Just stick around long enough and people will find out if you are for real. That’s how we found out that MWM was a troll and that Kathy was genuine.

  29. Svar says:

    @ Butterfly Flower

    Also, just cause a man flirts with you doesn’t mean he’s necessarily an alpha.

  30. Svar says:

    @ Butterfly Flower

    I meant to say “that you aren’t being genuine”

  31. aspiringlady says:

    Butterfly, If you are for real, I also wonder what you are doing to “flirt” that is creeping guys out. Maybe you need some flirting advice.

  32. My Name Is Jim says:

    Paige: “You mention flirting but not every decent guy is a good flirt or even able to recognize indicators of interest. It doesn’t mean they are “worthless betas”..it just means they are a bit obtuse in some areas.”

    Very true of younger guys, I should know because I was one of them. A lot of women Butterfly’s age could widen their choices somewhat by learning to pursue as well as be pursued. (There are resources for women on learning to seduce men just like there are for the other way around, google Arden Sirens for example.) Sometimes you have to be more than subtle, towards the right guy, at the right moment.

  33. Paige says:

    I once asked a guy out and got a long LTR out of it (2 years). He was slightly aspie so he wouldn’t have noticed an IOI if he was smacked over the head with it. I had to just say “hey.. can you drive me home?” (We worked together) and that led to us discussing weekend plans and me saying “It might be fun to hang out sometime”. My intentions were pretty obvious but yet not demanding or overly aggressive.

  34. My Name Is Jim says:

    What sucks though is once a guy does learn these basics and then looks back and realizes the women he blew off without thinking. A few months ago I had a dream where I apologized to one who I now realize wanted to go home with me after a party but I missed it. This was back in college and still I think about it once in a while. I sympathize with women dealing with this beta obtuseness with IOIs, a little but not that much. Every seducer must learn the disciplined handling of rejection.

  35. Butterfly Flower says:

    Butterfly, If you are for real, I also wonder what you are doing to “flirt” that is creeping guys out. Maybe you need some flirting advice.

    I smile and I try to start a conversation. “How’s your day…my name is…that’s an interesting book you’re reading…”

    Or if I’m feeling rather bold/sadistic, I’ll just blatantly say “I think you’re cute” and make the poor Beta squirm.

    I didn’t feel a huge initial attraction for all the guys I dated. In fact, the guy I ended up marrying wasn’t even my type but we went out together as friends and on the first date a spark ignited. He isn’t strictly alpha though he has some alpha-ish qualities. I really don’t know many guys who are strictly alpha/betas…most are a mix of both.

    So I shouldn’t be turning down Alphas rudely? I should give them a chance? Awh, but I like awkward aloof shy guys!

    You’re right, though. It’s immature for me to brush off guys that are interested in me too quickly. I’m young, what do I really know about my type?

  36. Badger says:

    “I flirt with shy “Beta” types, but they never respond well. They either ignore me or refuse to open up. I assume they’re not interested in me and I get discouraged from ever flirting with them again.”

    It sounds like BF is the one living the sour grapes story – “why aren’t these guys more thankful that a woman out of their league is hitting on them?!?” It actually sounds more like omegas she is hitting on. Young beta types don’t have hostility to women who are nice to them.

  37. Svar says:

    @ Badger

    Yep, that sounds right. She’s confusing Betas with Omegas.

  38. Svar says:

    I mean Omegas with Betas.

  39. MissMarie says:

    Butterfly Flower–

    Honestly, get over yourself. You aren’t owed anything. And if you’re online whining about it so much I hardly think you’re putting the proper effort into it anyway. Geez.

  40. Sebastian says:

    I don’t understand what the issue is here, folks. So what if “she’s” a troll, just offer some good advice and see what happens…

    BF,

    Do some online dating. It will maximize your value. On your site(s) include honest pictures of yourself, with your brothers, if you have any.

    Stipulate (if true) that:

    You are a virgin (that was my understanding from above) and plan to stay that way until you are married.

    That you want to have children first, and a career later (like when the youngest is minimum 14 – good guys want a woman who’s priority is wife & mother, but not lazy), but would work part time if your husband thinks it’s a good idea.

    Think it’s a good idea for the wife to do the daily finance work, but only spend money with her husband’s permission.

    That you are studying for a degree as an elementary school teacher, nurse, small animal vet, or some other radically traditional female career.

    That your parents are still married…

    Indicate all positive answers from here:

    http://dalrock.wordpress.com/2010/07/10/interviewing-a-prospective-wife-part-ii/

    (sorry, couldn’t hyper link it… again with the caveat that these are truthful answers)

    Throw in that you think husbands and wives need to put each other before the kids, because that is actually what is best for the kids.

    Are looking for a man that is 5-15 years older than you who is:
    1. An officer or senior enlisted (E-6 or above) in Air National Guard, Army National Guard, Marine Reserves, Naval Reserves, or Coast Guard.
    2. Agnostic/Atheist.
    3. Grew up helping his father do the family business of (logging, fishing, mining, construction, farming, electrician, mechanic, etc – some extremely traditional male work).
    4. Has never been married before (indicates good judgement).
    5. Has parents that are still married (sans natural death).

    Those conditions will narrow things down to a manageable level, if you really are a hot, Catholic virgin – nothing wrong with guys that aren’t in the Guard/Reserves, but if you are honestly representing yourself, then this demographic gives you a target rich environment for the Beta + types your (apparent) profile suggests. It also purges the field a bit of those with significant physical issues (again, I’m assuming you’re hot enough to be this picky). It’s important that he had to work growing up.

    Set up any meetings with prospective candidates in a public place where you can get a good look at them in advance. If you don’t see anyone consistent with pics – bolt…

    …Go out with anyone that honestly represented himself (remember, if he was ugly in the pics, you wouldn’t have chosen him) at least 3 times before deciding against… If the guy hasn’t tried to get at least somewhat physical with you before proposing, bolt, there is something wrong with him – the right guy will want to do anything he can get away with, but won’t dump you for refusing sex… don’t have sex until you’re married, then initiate once a week minimum, refuse his advances 1/3 of the time or less…

    …that wasn’t so hard.

  41. Sebastian says:

    guess it did hyperlink…

  42. Pingback: The Mouse, the Bird, and the Sausage | Dalrock

  43. @Bob,

    It took me a bit of pondering to figure this out myself.

    Basically, the King set up a contest. The third son was the most enterprising at winning the contest, and thus the hardest worker, even though he claimed to be the laziest. As a result, the King knew who the hardest worker was, and to that hardest worker went the Kingdom.

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